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Re: [ontolog-forum] Ontolgizing rain & snow [was: Track 1&2 Joint Missio

To: <doug@xxxxxxxxxx>, "'[ontolog-forum] '" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
From: "Rich Cooper" <rich@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 2012 14:49:51 -0800
Message-id: <4F8358BDC1A34143B3FE552ED09D55A7@Gateway>
Dear Doug,    (01)

Its interesting to see the many contexts for which
Cyc has built infrastructure.  A couple of days
ago, there was a post sequence on the Siri patent
which described "active ontology" as though it
were one ontology from a library of ontologies.
>From a quick review of the patent, it seems they
consider the "active ontology" to be the one which
best fits the situation at hand.      (02)

Since you are an accomplished expert on Cyc, can
you enlighten the rest of us about whether Cyc
uses the same or a similar concept, perhaps
calling it something else than the "active
ontology"?    (03)

Descriptions appreciated,
-Rich    (04)

Sincerely,
Rich Cooper
EnglishLogicKernel.com
Rich AT EnglishLogicKernel DOT com
9 4 9 \ 5 2 5 - 5 7 1 2    (05)

-----Original Message-----
From: ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of doug foxvog
Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2012 2:04 PM
To: [ontolog-forum]
Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Ontolgizing rain &
snow [was: Track 1&2 Joint Mission and Session
Abstracts]    (06)

> Being under heavy rain bombardment for several
days, a rare process in
> our parts, the atmospheric condition demands
more attention.
>
> Doug,
>
> What about methane rain, neon rain, sulfuric
acid rain, iron rain,
> volcanic ash rain, or rain dust, full of
chemicals, minerals and silt,
> we have here,
> in the Med Area, each early springtime from
North Africa.    (07)

Cyc has not modeled extra-terrestrial rain, but it
would be done similarly.
Their terms for rain refer to water rain.    (08)

They do have AcidRainProcess as a specialization
of RainProcess, and
have modeled Chemistry at the level of an
introductory college class
(actually: modelling the content of an AP
chemistry text -- for those
familiar with the US high school system).    (09)

The ontology has classes and relations for
representing material disolved
or suspended in rainwater.    (010)

> And how to formally represent the
precipitation/downfall/rain properties:
> types and forms, material and composition,
duration and intensity, speed
> and noise, quantity and quality, products and
results, or causes and
> effects ...    (011)

These are all basic concepts that have been well
thought out and
ontologized at the generic level in Cyc.  I only
have a copy of OpenCyc
on my computer, so don't have access to any rules
Cycorp may have
generated inter-relating such things .    (012)

Durations are specified as (#$MinutesDuration N)
[or another resolution];
downfall intensity can represented as (#$PerFn
(#$Centi #$Meter)
#$HoursDuration); and wind speed in some
#$UnitOfSpeed.    (013)

For causality, #$causes-SitSit would relate the
event of the storm (a
#$PhysicalEvent which is a type of #$Situation)
with a #$Situation which
it has caused.  To  state that the storm caused
some proposition to be
true, one would use (#$causes-ThingProp
BlizzardOf2012 <proposition>).    (014)

> It looks any seasonal falling to the planet of
any form of material refers
> to precipitation, as downfall of any from of
substance, rock, glass,
> water, etc.    (015)

Cyc's #$PrecipitationProcess allows for such
specializations of precipitation
to be defined and reasoned about.  Even without
creating new terms,
you could refer to #$PrecipitationParticles which
are #$composedOf
(#$SolutionFn (#$LiquidFn #$Water)
#$HydrogenChloride), or one in
which they are #$Suspensions with the
#$suspendingFluid being one
substance and with #$suspendedParts being some
other substance, such
as a (#$MobFn #$SandParticle)s.    (016)

It appears that they don't have a term for
#$VolcanicAsh    (017)

> Azamat
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "doug foxvog" <doug@xxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2012 8:11 PM
> Subject: [ontolog-forum] Ontolgizing rain & snow
[was: Track 1&2 Joint
> Mission and Session Abstracts]
>
>
> [ Also sent to ontology-summit discussion group.
]
>
> Matthew West wrote:
>
>> I understand your view. How shall you handle
rain and snow?
>
> Rain & snow refer to physical precipitation
particles, the precipitation
> in
> bulk, the process that produces the
precipitation, storms as events, and
> storms as objects.
>
> Cyc's representation of these different, but
related things (leaving out
> comments and some additional statements)
includes:
>
> (isa PrecipitationParticle ExistingObjectType)
> (genls PrecipitationParticle Particle)
> (genls PrecipitationParticle
InanimateObject-Natural)
>
> (isa RainProcess ProcessType)
> (genls RainProcess PrecipitationProcess)
>
> (isa SnowProcess ProcessType)
> (genls SnowProcess PrecipitationProcess)
>
> (isa Rainwater ExistingStuffType)
> (genls Rainwater (LiquidFn Water-Fresh))
>
> (isa SnowMob ExistingStuffType)
> (genls SnowMob (SolidFn Water))
>
> (isa Snowflake ExistingObjectType)
> (genls Snowflake PrecipitationParticle)
> (genls (MobFn Snowflake) SnowMob)
>
> (isa Raindrop ExistingObjectType)
> (genls Raindrop PrecipitationParticle)
> (genls Raindrop Rainwater)
>
> (relationAllExists outputsGenerated
PrecipitationProcess
>                          (MobFn
PrecipitationParticle))
> (relationAllExists outputsGenerated RainProcess
(MobFn Raindrop))
> (relationAllExists outputsGenerated SnowProcess
(MobFn Snowflake))
>
> (isa StormAsObject ExistingObjectType)
> (genls StormAsObject InanimateObject-Natural)
> (relationAllExists physicalParts StormAsObject
CloudInSky)
>
> (isa RainStormAsObject ExistingObjectType)
> (genls RainStormAsObject StormAsObject)
> (relationAllExists physicalParts StormAsObject
CloudInSky)
> (relationAllExists physicalParts StormAsObject
(MobFn Raindrop))
>
> (isa SnowStormAsObject ExistingObjectType)
> (genls SnowStormAsObject StormAsObject)
> (relationAllExists physicalParts StormAsObject
CloudInSky)
> (relationAllExists physicalParts
SnowStormAsObject (MobFn Snowflake))
>
> (not (relationExistsAll doneBy
PrecipitationProcess StormAsObject))
> (comment
>   (not (relationExistsAll doneBy
PrecipitationProcess StormAsObject))
>   "A StormAsObject would include Duststorms,
which don't (necessarily)
> include precipitation.")
>
> (relationExistsAll doneBy RainProcess
RainStormAsObject)
> (relationExistsAll doneBy SnowProcess
SnowStormAsObject)
>
> (isa StormAsEvent ExistingObjectType)
> (genls StormAsEvent ImmediateWeatherProcess)
>
> (isa RainStormAsEvent ExistingObjectType)
> (genls RainStormAsEvent StormAsEvent)
> (relationAllExists subprocesses RainStormAsEvent
RainProcess)
> (relationAllExists doneBy RainStormAsEvent
RainStormAsObject)
>
> (isa SnowStormAsEvent ExistingObjectType)
> (genls SnowStormAsEvent StormAsEvent)
> (relationAllExists subprocesses SnowStormAsEvent
SnowProcess)
> (relationAllExists doneBy SnowStormAsEvent
SnowStormAsObject)
>
> (isa SnowStormAsObject ExistingObjectType)
> (genls SnowStormAsObject StormAsObject)
> (relationAllExists physicalParts
SnowStormAsObject (MobFn Snowflake))
>
>
>> Jack
>> On Jan 26, 2012, at 6:09 AM, Matthew West
wrote:
>>
>>> The main problem here is one of different
people using terms
>>> differently. Hardly an ontological problem per
se, but certainly a
>>> problem that causes confusion in developing
ontologies.
>
> This is always a problem for ontologists.  The
different meanings have
> to be teased apart.
>
>>> Interestingly as a 4 dimensionalist I don't
recognise endurants at all,
>>> but I do recognise activities, physical
objects, and participants.
>>> Under
>>> this world view all individuals (including
activities, physical objects
>>> and participants) are spatiotemporal extents,
and you discover that an
>>> activity consists of its participants, where a
participant is the state
>>> of a physical object that participates in some
activity. So I recognise
>>> the things you talk about. However, I would
assign the term "system" to
>>> the physical object the participant is a state
of.
>
> I would not restrict the term "system" merely to
physical objects.  But
> having multiple clearly defined concepts which
different people use that
> word
> for in different contexts, is fine.  They just
need different URIs.
>
> -- doug
>
>>> Regards
>>>
>>> Matthew West
>>> Information  Junction
>>> Tel: +44 1489 880185
>>> Mobile: +44 750 3385279
>>> Skype: dr.matthew.west
>>> matthew.west@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> http://www.informationjunction.co.uk/
>>> http://www.matthew-west.org.uk/
>>>
>>> This email originates from Information
Junction Ltd. Registered in
>>> England and Wales No. 6632177.
>>> Registered office: 2 Brookside, Meadow Way,
Letchworth Garden City,
>>> Hertfordshire, SG6 3JE.
>>> ...
>
>
>
>
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