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Re: [ontolog-forum] Current Semantic Web Layer pizza (was ckae)

To: "[ontolog-forum] " <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
From: "Obrst, Leo J." <lobrst@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2007 13:16:05 -0400
Message-id: <9F771CF826DE9A42B548A08D90EDEA80024D0DC3@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
We have a saying, Azamat and John, about the pot calling the kettle
black. Perhaps you've heard of that?    (01)

Thanks,
Leo    (02)

>-----Original Message-----
>From: ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
>[mailto:ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Azamat
>Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 12:21 PM
>To: [ontolog-forum] 
>Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Current Semantic Web Layer pizza 
>(was ckae)
>
>John,
>You are too diplomatic, like a wise politician. It is good when one is    (03)

>politic and polite, but we try to do science here, questing after 
>ontological truths, and thus must be truthful.
>If to be so frank, I am inclined to agree with a confidential 
>opinion of one 
>of the architects of the SUO concept:
>''...there are way too many people who just like to hear 
>themselves talk, 
>who consider themselves experts, who have no
>experience in ontology, but feel compelled to participate in the 
>discussion.''
>
>Although being members, many good minds, capable to critically 
>contribute, 
>keep distance from any active debate. Instead, you have to read funny 
>musings on silence in music, etc., served by the same folk.
>It looks we need to radically upgrade the level of our 
>discussions to meet 
>the requirements of the OntoForum.
>Or, I encourage to pay more attention to Jim's effort to renew 
>the SUO's 
>listing, which had made an essential contribution to the 
>standard ontology 
>subject, regardless PY is doing the best job possible.
>
>Azamat Abdoullaev
>
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: "John F. Sowa" <sowa@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>To: "[ontolog-forum]" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 4:06 PM
>Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Current Semantic Web Layer pizza 
>(was ckae)
>
>
>> Might I remind people that this thread started with a discussion
>> of how the pieces of the SemWeb are related to ontology.
>>
>> John Cage's compositions are worth some discussion, but perhaps
>> the amount spent so far has strayed a bit off topic.
>>
>> John
>
>SUO Subscribers,
>
>Here's a project that needs our help; and in turn, could provide
>a user base for an upper ontology.
>
>The Problem:  We all have lots of data, but it's all 
>inconsistent and we
>don't have control over it.
>
>Current Efforts:
>
>Microsoft Windows CardSpace (formerly InfoCard)(They don't need
>our help.)
>
>Higgins Project:
>http://www.eclipse.org/higgins/higgins-charter.php
>This is an open source effort.  'Higgins' comes from a
>name of mouse.
>Mission: To improve interoperability, privacy, and
>security as well as empower users with more control over their
personal
>information.
>Higgins User-Centric Ontology
>http://wiki.eclipse.org/Higgins_Ontology  Good start, but they need
our
>need and have welcomed it.  This message invites participation by all.
>Please forward to others, who can subscribe by sending the message
>SUBSCRIBE STANDARD-UPPER-ONTOLOGY to listserv@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
>I propose we:
>
>1. Brainstorm and recruit particiation via this list for a
>couple weeks, then move to a new list to focus.
>
>2. Review the current Higgins user-centric ontology
>http://www.eclipse.org/higgins/ontologies/2006/higgins.owl and start
>providing suggestions.
>
>3. Develop strawman ontologies based on different upper
>ontologies. Evalaute, compare, and provide results to the Higgins
>project, which might decide to base later releases on an upper 
>ontology.
>
>
>If Higgins takes off, it could grow as fast as Myspace or
>FaceBook, and of all the companies, organizations, and governments
that
>deal with these users, some will choose to use the same upper
ontology.
>
>This kicks of the brainstorming, so please post your thoughts.
>
>Jim Schoening >
>>
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>    (04)

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