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Re: [ontolog-forum] Current Semantic Web Layer Cake

To: "[ontolog-forum]" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, "John F. Sowa" <sowa@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: SW-forum <semantic-web@xxxxxx>
From: Duane Nickull <dnickull@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2007 16:54:25 -0700
Message-id: <C2D519C1.4E04%dnickull@xxxxxxxxx>
Peter:    (01)

That jives with my beliefs, as crooked and warped as they may be.    (02)

;-)    (03)

/d    (04)

On 7/31/07 2:13 PM, "Peter F Brown" <peter@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:    (05)

> Duane:
> You are right. This goes to the heart of the issue of "vicious circularity"
> that Whitehead and Russell had thought was sorted with Principia Mathematica,
> until Kurt Gödel came along and demolished their shiny, perfect, world. An
> ontology is not just some self-referencing and self-sustaining model that is
> somehow "complete"; it points out to the real world, as you rightly say.
> Before there is a flame war on this, I should underline that we discussed this
> extensively at the Ontology Summit, and there was an (uncomfortable for some)
> consensus that there is "Ontology" as *the* study of being; and there are
> "ontologies" that are domain-specific encapsulations of some aspect of the
> real world.
> Peter
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Duane Nickull
> Sent: 31 July 2007 16:05
> To: [ontolog-forum]; John F. Sowa
> Cc: 'SW-forum'
> Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Current Semantic Web Layer Cake
> On 7/31/07 12:46 PM, "Azamat" <abdoul@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> The real semantics or meanings of any symbolism or notation is defined by
>> ontology; for this is the only knowledge domain studying the Being of
>> Everything which is, happens and relates.
> Not trying to start a nit picky argument, but I had always thought that real
> semantics are defined by how a term is used and what it is linked to in a
> physical world (which of course can be captured and expressed in an
> ontology).  Otherwise any ontology is just a huge circular reference (like
> the english dictionary when void of any grounding.
> How can one define and convey the true meaning of spicy food, heat, pain etc
> without the corresponding grounding experience?
> Duane     (06)

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