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Re: [ontology-summit] [Quality] What means

To: Ontology Summit 2008 <ontology-summit@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
From: Pat Hayes <phayes@xxxxxxx>
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2008 08:56:14 -0500
Message-id: <p06230919c4096d365955@[192.168.1.2]>
At 12:07 AM -0400 3/21/08, Patrick Cassidy wrote:
>John,
>    Among the 'reviewers' is there any reason not to have an expert committee
>that can create a binary distinction of, e.g. "well-structured" and "not
>well-structured"?  The imprimatur can be an alternative to absolute
>exclusion, and still serve the legitimate concerns that Barry has about
>poorly constructed ontologies.    (01)

If these terms could be given any kind of precise 
meaning (other than something close to "done the 
way I like") then maybe this idea would make 
sense. However, I see no such meaning anywhere 
even on the horizon at present. We simply do not 
yet know what 'well structured' can possibly 
mean, as a general category or classification 
applying uniformly to all ontologies. The world 
has not yet even settled on a single class of 
basic logics to write ontologies in, and notions 
of 'well-structured' must be hostage to the 
underlying language, since the same structure may 
easily be an efficient and robust technique in 
one language and a syntax error or worse in 
another. Most of the criteria given for approval 
in the OBO framework are controversial, for 
example. (BTW, the reason I keep citing OBO is 
that it is the only extant example to cite, not 
that I wish it ill.)    (02)

The only effect of such a mechanism in actual 
practice will be to impose some kind of 
essentially arbitrary conformity on ontology 
construction. Which may, indeed, for 
interoperation purposes within a well-defined 
community with shared goals and purposes - that 
is, for standardization purposes - be a useful 
effect. But then let us not call the result an 
'open' repository.    (03)

Pat Hayes    (04)

>
>Pat
>
>Patrick Cassidy
>MICRA, Inc.
>908-561-3416
>cell: 908-565-4053
>cassidy@xxxxxxxxx
>
>
>>  -----Original Message-----
>>  From: ontology-summit-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ontology-summit-
>>  bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of John F. Sowa
>>  Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2008 11:56 PM
>>  To: Ontology Summit 2008
>>  Subject: Re: [ontology-summit] [Quality] What means
>>
>>  Pat, Barry, Deborah, and Ed,
>>
>>  Barry asked an important question that gets to the heart of
>>  the issues we have been discussing:
>>
>>  BS> What are scientific journals for?  Why do they employ a peer
>>   > review process?
>>
>>  There are two independent issues here:  reviewing and publishing.
>>  Everybody would agree that reviewing is important, but ideally,
>>  the readers/users should have the option of making their own
>>  choices based on the reviews.  When publication was expensive,
>>  the publishers became gatekeepers because it was economically
>>  impractical to publish everything.
>>
>>  But with the WWW, new options are available.  Publication is
>>  almost free, and we have the luxury of decoupling the reviewing
>>  process from the gatekeeping process.  Metadata enables that
>>  decoupling:
>>
>>    1. All submissions to the OOR can be made available as soon
>>       as they are submitted.
>>
>>    2. The metadata associated with each submission can indicate
>>       what tests were made, what the reviewers said, and what
>>       results the users, if any, obtained.
>>
>>    3. Users can choose to see ontologies sorted by any criteria
>>       they want:  in the order of best reviews, most thorough
>>       testing, greatest usage, greatest relevance to a particular
>>       domain, or any weighted combination.
>>
>>  PH> This is where I part company with Barry, and indeed where I
>>  > believe that the very idea of controlling the contents of an OOR
>>  > (noting that the first O means 'open') needs to be examined very,
>>  > very carefully. Of course we would not argue that majority voting
>>  > should be used to choose scientific theories; but ontologies,
>>  > even those used by scientists, are not themselves scientific
>>  > theories.
>>
>>  Ontologies overlap philosophy, engineering, science, and mathematics.
>>  The closest model we have is the metadata registry, but new policies
>>  can and should be explored.
>  >
>>  BS>> While refrigerator manufacturers may allow democratic ranking
>>  >> to influence e.g. size and color, they would use other strategies
>>  >> e.g. in matters of thermodynamics.
>>
>>  PH> Perhaps so: but we are here discussing matters of ontology, and
>>  > in the current state of the art, this may have more in common
>>  > with consumer product choice than with thermodynamics.
>>
>>  That is the point I was trying to emphasize.  The application
>>  developers have deeper understanding of their specific needs and
>>  problems than any general gatekeeper or committee of gatekeepers.
>>
>>  DM> CSI, the specification writing organization for building
>>   > architecture, says quality is "a mirror of the requirements."
>>
>>  That's a good point, which implies that different set of
>>  requirements might lead to a different ranking of the same
>>  ontologies.   No gatekeeper can anticipate the requirements
>>  of all possible users.
>>
>>  DM> Do you think the gatekeepers can help define the OOR requirements
>>   > and set up the dynamic tests?
>>
>>  I'd prefer to keep the reviewers and replace the gatekeepers with
>>  caretakers who have a broader role along the lines you suggested.
>>
>>  EB> I'm thinking about bureaucrats. I think that many ontologies
>>   > (and more broadly, concept systems including thesauri, taxonomies,
>>   > etc.) have been and will be developed for use within the mission
>>   > areas of government agencies. There can be a vetting process to
>>   > "approve" a concept system/ontology for use within a community
>>   > of interest.
>>
>>  That suggests a further refinement of the roles of reviewers and
>>  gatekeepers/caretakers.  At the source, there are individuals and/or
>>  organizations, who develop ontologies and make them available.
>>  Among the users, there may be organizations, coalitions, or
>>  bureaucracies that evaluate the ontologies and determine which
>>  of them are best suited to their groups of users.
>>
>>  That is another reason for replacing the gatekeepers in the OOR
>>  with caretakers.  Any gatekeeping that might be useful would be
>>  better done by user groups at a level close to the applications
>>  than by any gatekeeper that is close to the ontology providers.
>>
>>  John
>>
>>
>>
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