Len (01)
Appreciate the observation to bring us down to Earth. (02)
I thought the context was "logical types" and it still raises a
question, does the physical and philosophical defintion need to refer
to two different concepts of time? It is the physical instantiation of
time that has to relate to measurable effect/ entity? (03)
Do not such systems have a notion of counting time backward to reach
past events and epochs as well as business transactions? Hence the
arrow is bidirectional in past - future sense?
Yes - If a particle or object is stationary the only way to determine
it is by time stamp and yes in that sense it is an increasing time
count. Ed Barkmeyer or Mark Linehan can better describe it in Semantic
/ Vocabulary sense than me, however.
Thanks.
Ravi (04)
On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 10:02 PM, Len Yabloko <lenyabloko@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> Time is not necessarily an arrow but
>> because similar to short
>> distances on earth, it appears to be so. Some philosophies
>> view it as
>> cyclic or Wheel like (Sanskrit: Kaal Chakra) Wheel of
>> Time.
>>
>
> We were discussing a time as physical phenomenon - not philosophical concept.
>The "arrow of time" refers to the property of some systems that makes it
>impossible to derive initial conditions from current state - hence the one-way
>arrow.
>
>> On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 3:57 PM, Len Yabloko <lenyabloko@xxxxxxxxx>
>> wrote:
>> > Paola,
>> >
>> > The very first line of this paper is arguably wrong:
>> >
>> > "Objectively, time does not pass, physics reveals no
>> such phenomenon"
>> >
>> > I can agree that physics still lack a coherent theory
>> of "time arrow". But that does mean it "reveals no such
>> phenomenon". There are sevral known attempt to account for
>> time in theoretical physics.
>> >
>> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrow_of_time
>> >
>> > While writing this answer I had come accross this
>> article
>> >
>> > http://www.temple.edu/psychology/overton/documents/ArrowTime_CycleTime.pdf
>> >
>> > --- On Thu, 1/21/10, Paola Di Maio <paola.dimaio@xxxxxxxxx>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> From: Paola Di Maio <paola.dimaio@xxxxxxxxx>
>> >> Subject: [ontolog-forum] correct Logical types
>> >> To: "[ontolog-forum]" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> >> Date: Thursday, January 21, 2010, 9:43 AM
>> >> thanks to a link posted in another forum
>> >> (thanks DM/TGL)
>> >>
>> >> i come across the notion of Logical Types
>> >> specificaly interested in 'correct logical types
>> >>
>> >> I know it may be too far a philosophical push fror
>> some on
>> >> this list
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I am rushing around and dont have much time to
>> >> study/discuss in depth
>> >>
>> >> i hope it is of interest, so posting for
>> reference
>> >>
>> >>
>http://philsci-archive.pitt.edu/archive/00005073/01/Transtemporal_Phenomenal_Consciousness.pdf
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> proposes a systems thnking view of logical
>> stances
>> >>
>> >> quasi random excerpts
>> >>
>> >> Relativity requires that we consider the dimension
>> of time
>> >> on a par with the spatial dimensions, thus making
>> a block
>> >> universe inevitable. The concept of change can be
>> recovered
>> >> by considering a sequence of definitions of the
>> block
>> >> universe, and thus the passage of time can be
>> considered to
>> >> be the change of this definition, resulting in a
>> sequence of
>> >> block universes as transtemporal reality
>> >>
>> >> ........
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> 6 Logical Type
>> >> In order to make the ideas more accessible I have
>> described
>> >> the process as one of experiencing, but this is
>> the
>> >> subjective perspective of the underlying
>> phenomenon, the
>> >> indexical change of the functional frame of
>> reference, the
>> >> exercise of the collapse dynamics, which is on
>> this view an
>> >> emergent property of the system as a whole. That
>> the
>> >> collapse dynamics is meta to the physical is at
>> first a very
>> >> counterintuitive idea, but this is what is
>> required to give
>> >> rise to a process of the correct logical type.
>> Given that
>> >> all of the moments exist in static array,
>> iteration is
>> >> required in order for there to be any
>> transtemporal
>> >> phenomena, and a transition through a succession
>> of
>> >> definitions of the linear dynamics is a process
>> meta to the
>> >> physical; the linear dynamics is the logical
>> arrangement of
>> >> interactions of the matter and energy in the
>> spacetime of
>> >> the universe, and the change to this layout is of
>> a
>> >> different logical type to the layout itself.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> ...
>> >> .........
>> >> What would be required is something that is to the
>> moments
>> >> as the projector is to the movie, something that
>> contains
>> >> all the moments and iterates the sequence. Clearly
>> only the
>> >> unitary system as a whole contains all the moments
>> of any
>> >> given sequence. Additionally, the only possible
>> expression
>> >> of the necessary logical type for an iterator is
>> an emergent
>> >> property of the system as a whole; only the system
>> as a
>> >> whole is of the correct logical type to change
>> the
>> >> functional frame of reference from one block
>> universe to
>> >> another, giving rise to the appearance of collapse
>> described
>> >> by Everett. Objectively this transtemporal process
>> is the
>> >> collapse dynamics, subjectively it is phenomenal
>> >> consciousness passing through time.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> end exerpts
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Paola Di Maio
>> >>
>> **************************************************
>> >> “Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination
>> will take
>> >> you everywhere.”
>> >> Albert Einstein
>> >>
>> **************************************************
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
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>> --
>> Thanks.
>> Ravi
>> (Dr. Ravi Sharma)
>> 313 204 1740 Mobile
>>
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Thanks.
Ravi
(Dr. Ravi Sharma)
313 204 1740 Mobile (06)
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