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Re: [ontolog-forum] A No-Go Result For Human-Level Machine Intelligence‏

To: "'[ontolog-forum] '" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
From: "Dr. Ravi Sharma" <drravisharma@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2015 04:43:53 -0800
Message-id: <000301d03965$c81824d0$58486e70$@gmail.com>
John    (01)

I read a bit on your two links - more related to language and understanding
as well as Steven's paper on experience.    (02)

From Amoeba to Pisces - is there not enough intelligence to survive and
reproduce, also at insect level it has some innovation. Also a mystery as to
how primitive life forms evolved such intelligent mechanisms for
self-protection and reproduction? For example plants having colors to
attract insets for pollination.
I wonder if Penrose would consider these life forms to be within the realm
of computability, especially their minds or levels of understanding.
Regards,
Ravi
-----Original Message-----
From: ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of John F Sowa
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2015 11:04 PM
To: ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] A No-Go Result For Human-Level Machine
Intelligenceþ    (03)

Steven,    (04)

By structure,  I assume that you mean something along the lines of
https://www.createspace.com/Preview/1137409    (05)

As I said before, I think it's an interesting hypothesis.  I would put in
the same category as the Penrose-Hameroff hypothesis.  I'll wait and see,
but I wouldn't bet on it without a lot more evidence.    (06)

> you are still thinking about the problem "electronically" 
> (connectionist)    (07)

I think about it in as many ways as I have encountered, and I wouldn't rule
out an infinity of other options.  But I have more confidence in some than
others, and I frequently quote Whitehead:    (08)

ANW
> Systems, scientific and philosophic, come and go. Each method of 
> limited understanding is at length exhausted. In its prime each system 
> is a triumphant success: in its decay it is an obstructive nuisance.    (09)

I don't know what you mean by "connectionist".  But in my negative remarks
about Jeff H, I hope you noticed that artificial neural networks are a
version that I think (a) is useful for a limited range of applications, but
(b) is not on the road to "strong AI"
or even advanced applications of ordinary AI.    (010)

As for neuroscience, I believe that there's a continuum from protozoa (such
as paramecia) to bilateral worms around 600 million years ago, the split
between protostomia (insects, molluscs, etc.) and deuterostomia (vertebrates
such as fish and humans). I agree with many neuroscientists who believe that
versions of consciousness are present at least as early as fish and insects.
I doubt that consciousness is a "problem" that needs any special
explanation.    (011)

As for strong AI, I really don't know whether digital computers can ever be
intelligent at a human level.  But as I said in the micai.pdf slides, they
can do much better than current AI systems.    (012)

As for philosophy, I have learned a great deal from both eastern and western
philosophers from antiquity to the present.  Following are two articles that
are representative statements:    (013)

http://www.jfsowa.com/pubs/signproc.htm
Signs, processes, and language games    (014)

http://www.jfsowa.com/pubs/rolelog.pdf
The role of logic and ontology in language and reasoning    (015)

John    (016)

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