On Mon, August 16, 2010 14:36, AzamatAbdoullaev said:
> RC wrote:
>> ...
>> "Another interesting aspect of your answer is that you use the word
>> "thing" as the most general of all thingish words like object, plurality,
>> stuff, material .; is that your mental image of the word "thing", as the
>> most abstract of all objects? (01)
> ASHA: Yes, Thing refers to the Universal Class of all sorts of entities,
> implying the universal property of all entities, whereas Nothing refers to
> the Null Class . (02)
There are many definitions of "thing". It is useful to have a common
term for the universal class and many ontologies have used the word
"thing". (03)
> RC: Can a "thing" include an action, method, plan, history of the
> foregoing?" (04)
> ASHA: In the broad sense, it is a substance, state, change, process as far
> as "every sign is also a thing, for what is not a thing is nothing at
> all". (05)
Extending this, classes/types, relations/predicates, and functions are
also "things" if they are in the universe of discourse. Cyc's #$Thing
includes all these as instances as well as individuals. (06)
> In NL, words are the signs of ideas and images, thoughts and feelings,
> while the mental signs are the similitudes of things. (07)
> The beauty of machines consists in that they don't require the mental
> signs (ideas and images) as the medium whereby symbols (physical signals)
> could signify the real things. (08)
They do require symbols other than the symbols used by humans, similar to
the significants in human minds. (09)
-- doug (010)
> Azamat Abdoullaev
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Rich Cooper
> To: '[ontolog-forum] '
> Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 12:20 AM
> Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Triadic Sign Relations
>
>
> Hi Azamat,
>
>
>
> You wrote:
>
>
>
> "That confuses me no end if Peirceans can't tie the theory to some
> commonly understood reality for me. Is there a more fruitful
> description that explains the language used and chosen for that
> representation?"
>
> Rich,
>
> The nature of signs and symbols and significations, their definition,
> elements, and types, was mainly established by Aristotle, Augustine, and
> Aquinas.
>
> According to these classic sources, significance is a relationship
> between two sorts of things: signs and the kinds of things they signify
> (intend, express or mean), where one term necessarily causes something
> else to come to the mind. Distinguishing natural signs and conventional
> signs, the traditional theory of signs sets the following threefold
> partition of things:
>
> 1.. There are things that are just things, not any sign at all;
> 2.. There are things that are also signs of other things (as natural
> signs of the physical world and mental signs of the mind);
> 3.. There are things that are always signs, as languages (natural and
> artificial) and other cultural nonverbal symbols, as documents, money,
> ceremonies, and rites. see a brief but comprehensive account,
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sign
> Azamat Abdoullaev
>
>
>
> Thanks for your view on this; it helps me compare and contrast my own
> theoretical understanding with yours.
>
>
>
> So a familiar sign S represents another sign S2 in one agent's mind, yet
> can represent only S itself in another agent's mind, while
> simultaneously representing S3 (money, a document .) to still another
> agent?
>
>
>
> Another interesting aspect of your answer is that you use the word
> "thing" as the most general of all thingish words like object,
> plurality, stuff, material .; is that your mental image of the word
> "thing", as the most abstract of all objects?
>
>
>
> Can a "thing" include an action, method, plan, history of the foregoing?
>
>
>
> Thanks for the stimulating viewpoint,
>
> -Rich
>
>
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Rich Cooper
>
> EnglishLogicKernel.com
>
> Rich AT EnglishLogicKernel DOT com
>
> 9 4 9 \ 5 2 5 - 5 7 1 2
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
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doug foxvog doug@xxxxxxxxxx http://ProgressiveAustin.org (012)
"I speak as an American to the leaders of my own nation. The great
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- Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.
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