Vhris wrote:
My *hunch* is that he is trying to illustrate that written English is
ambiguous (which, of course, we already knew full well) and that this
somehow throws the concept of identity into doubt. I think that is a
very confused idea. But maybe that's not what he has in mind; all I can
do is guess. Is it just me? (01)
If you check out that line - it is the same proposition in two copies on two
sides of a relation sign?
How can they be the same? In Form? In Content?
In form they cannot be the same as they take up different space and you read
then subsequently.
In content: it is then interpreted by different people with different
background knowledge.For instance those who interpret two string connected
with an equal sign as an entry word in a dictionary and its meaning
(annotation) would find that a tautology. It would be nice to see what
meaning is then in that sense: is it not just the next string of words that
you recall in an answer to the question? (02)
"Knowledge is an ordered acess to information" Iformation is not just form,
it is content. "The media is the message" was a bloody lie. Now you call
those in the media as a Content providers. Come on, Chris. We live in the
same world despite speaking Different Languages. can we change reality by
calling it a different name?
Cheers
ferenc (03)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Christopher Menzel" <cmenzel@xxxxxxxx>
To: "[ontolog-forum]" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:13 AM
Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Ontologies as social mediators
(was:Ontologydevelopment method) (04)
> Burkett, William [USA] wrote:
>> I guess I live in Ferenc's world, Chris. Setting aside some sentence
>> construction problems, I understand what he's saying and agree with it
>> - and I don't understand your perspective that his assertions are
>> false/meaningless.
>
> Hey, I said my lights are dim. But I'd certainly be impressed if you
> could convincingly render the first statement in the following paragraph
> in a way that makes it true (and recall that this came in the context of
> an expression of doubt about the logical validity of the principles of
> identity -- so a translation that takes "identical" to mean something
> other than identity doesn't count):
>
>> > A proposal in a natural language may not be identical withn itself.
>> > E.g. No one likes to be contradicted =/ No one likes to be
>> > contradicted Or: Everyone loves finding another one in contradiction
>> > with him/herself Subject to the emphasis you may vary when reading
>> > it out, you will have diferent meanings exposed. Or in simple
>> > English: I want to pay you for your contribution.
>
> And I'd be happy simply with a *coherent* rendering of the sentences
> after the first. I just don't understand what's going on there at all.
> My *hunch* is that he is trying to illustrate that written English is
> ambiguous (which, of course, we already knew full well) and that this
> somehow throws the concept of identity into doubt. I think that is a
> very confused idea. But maybe that's not what he has in mind; all I can
> do is guess. Is it just me?
>
>> Ferenc's statement that he's a linguist is important to understanding
>> his (and my) perspective. I think linguistics has a LOT more to
>> contribute to the field of ontology development than logic does.
>
> Well, of course, that depends on what aspect of ontology development you
> are talking about but if you have in mind the creation of ontologies
> from documents and domain experts (as opposed to the development of
> reasoning and integration mechanisms) I'd probably agree. But obviously
> both linguistics and logic are central to the overall vision of
> ontological engineering.
>
> -chris
>
>
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