On 5/22/13 11:00 AM, doug foxvog wrote:
> On Wed, May 22, 2013 08:02, Kingsley Idehen wrote:
>> On 5/22/13 4:17 AM, Matthew West wrote:
>>>> I am interested in view points about the following claim:
>>>> Relations are the fundamental mechanism for expressing Data.
>>>> Basically, Data Representation is all about
>>>> encoding Relations. This assumes that all observations boils down
>>>> to perception of relationships (relations) between entities.
>>> MW: OK until the last bit. You seem to be equating relationships
>>> to relations. Not a good move in my view. I take a relationship
>>> to be a real world phenomenon and a relation
>>> to be a mathematical structure. Whilst relations can be used
>>> to represent relationships, there is certainly not
>>> necessarily a one-to-one relationship between relationships
>>> and relations.
>>> For example in relational databases it is common practice
>>> to use a single relation (record type)
>>> to represent multiple real world relationships.
>> As per my response to Pat, I am on a quest to construct a simple
>> narrative targeting less technical audiences. Thus, I've opted to make a
>> little comprise by being a little lossy about Relations and Relationships.
> In your note to Pat, you mentioned using RDF.
>
> As Matthew mentions above, data base systems use a record with
> multiple data elements to express a relation. (01)
Yes they do. (02)
> Although this often
> includes multiple binary relations, it also includes cases of ternary
> and higher order relations. (03)
Which are facilitated via views (transient or materialized) or join
queries, right? (04)
> RDF does have awkward ways of
> representing such relations, but a syntax that is not limited to
> triples would be (imho) far better to use, especially when "targeting
> less technical audiences." (05)
Yes-ish, but I don't know of any non technical audience profiles that
would be confused by structured data being expressed (presented) and
encoded using patterns that resemble basic sentence structure. RDBMS
vendors successfully built an industry around a misaligned view of data
via the two-dimensional table and literal identifiers. If that could be
done, I do believe one could also build an industry around a more
accurate conceptual view of data using an entity relationship model
based on subject->predicate->object relations expression syntax that can
be encoded using a variety of notations. (06)
In my experience, RDF is all about enhancing the existing entity
relationship model [1] by adding the following to the mix: (07)
1. explicit (rather than implicit) machine- and human-comprehensible
entity relationship semantics;
2. use of IRIs as the mechanism for denoting subject, predicate, and
objects of relations. (08)
The perceived awkwardness of the above shouldn't be a definitive
detraction per se. :-) (09)
Links: (010)
[1] http://bit.ly/YTdz3N -- Peter Chen's 1976 dissertation about the
unified view of data using the entity relationship model . (011)
Kingsley
>
> -- doug foxvog
>
>> Kingsley
>>> Regards
>>>
>>> Matthew West
>>> Information Junction
>>> Tel: +44 1489 880185
>>> Mobile: +44 750 3385279
>>> Skype: dr.matthew.west
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>>>
>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Kingsley Idehen
>>>> Founder & CEO
>>>> OpenLink Software
>>>> Company Web: http://www.openlinksw.com
>>>> Personal Weblog: http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/~kidehen
>>>> Twitter/Identi.ca handle: @kidehen
>>>> Google+ Profile: https://plus.google.com/112399767740508618350/about
>>>> LinkedIn Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/kidehen
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
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>>
>> --
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Kingsley Idehen
>> Founder & CEO
>> OpenLink Software
>> Company Web: http://www.openlinksw.com
>> Personal Weblog: http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/~kidehen
>> Twitter/Identi.ca handle: @kidehen
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> (012)
-- (013)
Regards, (014)
Kingsley Idehen
Founder & CEO
OpenLink Software
Company Web: http://www.openlinksw.com
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Twitter/Identi.ca handle: @kidehen
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