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Re: [ontolog-forum] rant on pseudoscience

To: "[ontolog-forum]" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
From: ravi sharma <drravisharma@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2010 05:52:08 -0500
Message-id: <f872f57b1001230252o636a938dgbce79785184aee18@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
This shows that renaissance happen(s) whereever there is freedom of thought and in that environment progress and science thrive in a sustainable way. It has happened in cycles in different parts of world and we all enjoy the cumulative fruits of that knowledge. The same minds (persons) that do not produce visible research outputs but when they are transported to countires and regions that support freedom of thought, become often productive and even get Nobel Prize or other recognitions. It is allmostly about fearless pursuit and environments that support it.

On Fri, Jan 22, 2010 at 6:05 PM, Rob Freeman <lists@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Sat, Jan 23, 2010 at 3:57 AM, John F. Sowa <sowa@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> RF> Greg Chaitin might have issue with that statement.
> No.  He wouldn't object to that statement.

You can choose to speculate that way if you wish.

I suggest anyone interested read Chaitin in the original. He is a very
enjoyable read.

> ... the big question is why Europe
> took off so suddenly while the rest of the world stagnated.

That's a fair interpretation of Kuhn's statement.

> Crosby attributes the rapid development to the growth in
> methods and precision of measurement, and I'm sure that made
> an important contribution.  Crosby mentions the development
> of European universities, starting with Paris and Oxford in
> the late 12th century and rapidly expanding throughout major
> cities in Europe during the 13th.  But he doesn't go into
> any detail about the role of the universities or how they
> differed from the older centers of learning.
> The crucial feature of Plato's Academy and Aristotle's Lyceum
> was the highly stimulating debates.  (Stylized hints of those
> debates can be found in Plato's dialogs.)  The Greeks continued
> the debating for a few centuries, but it gradually lost much
> of the excitement of the early years.  But when the European
> universities opened up, they renewed an active form of debate,
> which they called "disputation".
> Those debates could get very lively and even entertaining
> (in Latin, of course).  As late as the 16th or 17th century,
> the English Court would go to Oxford or Cambridge for the
> graduation exercises.  Queen Elizabeth I even served as the
> "magister" or moderator of the debate.  King James was very
> fond of his hunting dogs, so one of the debates was on the
> topic of whether dogs can think.  King James enjoyed it
> thoroughly and rooted for the dogs.
> The end of innovation comes when the powers that be feel
> threatened by the debate and start burning books and imposing
> censorship.  Hegel said that the best thing that ever happened
> to Europe was the Protestant Reformation.  He didn't think that
> the Protestant ideas were any better than the Catholic ones,
> but that the debate invigorated both sides and kept them
> from stagnating.

Like you, I don't think anyone knows the answer to this for sure. We
are lucky and things seem to keep moving, but there is no guarantee
that will continue.


(Dr. Ravi Sharma)
313 204 1740 Mobile

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