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## Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?

 To: "[ontolog-forum]" Александр Шкотин Thu, 5 Feb 2009 21:41:05 +0300
 John,   in axiomatic theory there is a small group of initial entities (predicates, constants, functions) we may say mutualy defined by axioms. This is why circles and loops in definitions are very important - we can find initial entities.   And for example in NBG set theory: there is only one initial entity - binary predicate 'in'.   Alex 2009/2/5 John F. Sowa Azamat,That is not only true, it is inevitable:  > You must know such common things that most dictionary definitions > are ending in loops.In mathematics, the field in which the most precise definitions arewritten, there are very few "closed form" definitions that define some entity type X as a structure composed of previously defined types.Instead, the axioms of mathematical systems are usually stated asrelationships among terms, none of which can be defined independently. It would be extremely unlikely that the real world in all itscomplexity should happen to be so simple that all our conceptionsof it could be defined by the simplest form of definition.For a more realistic view, see the _Web of Belief_ by Quine and Ullian:    http://socialistica.lenin.ru/analytic/txt/q/quine_1.htm   The Web of BeliefFollowing is an article that discusses the Quine-Ullian view and relates it to other methods of definition:   http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/justep-coherence/   Coherentist Theories of Epistemic Justification An excerpt:   "Quine's web of belief metaphor -- according to which our beliefs   form an interconnected web in which the structure hangs or falls   as a whole."No term in that web can be defined by itself.  They are all defined by the pattern of relationships to other terms.  This view hasstrong similarities to Wittgenstein's language games (which probablyhad a strong influence on Quine and Ullian).John _________________________________________________________________Message Archives: http://ontolog.cim3.net/forum/ontolog-forum/ Config Subscr: http://ontolog.cim3.net/mailman/listinfo/ontolog-forum/Unsubscribe: mailto:ontolog-forum-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Shared Files: http://ontolog.cim3.net/file/Community Wiki: http://ontolog.cim3.net/wiki/To join: http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?WikiHomePage#nid1J To Post: mailto:ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ``` _________________________________________________________________ Message Archives: http://ontolog.cim3.net/forum/ontolog-forum/ Config Subscr: http://ontolog.cim3.net/mailman/listinfo/ontolog-forum/ Unsubscribe: mailto:ontolog-forum-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Shared Files: http://ontolog.cim3.net/file/ Community Wiki: http://ontolog.cim3.net/wiki/ To join: http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?WikiHomePage#nid1J To Post: mailto:ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx    (01) ```
 Current Thread Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, (continued) Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, paola . dimaio Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Александр Шкотин Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Azamat Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Александр Шкотин Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Pat Hayes Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Александр Шкотин Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Pat Hayes Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Azamat Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Pat Hayes Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, John F. Sowa Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Александр Шкотин <= Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, John F. Sowa Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Pat Hayes Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Pat Hayes Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Александр Шкотин Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Pat Hayes Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Александр Шкотин Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Александр Шкотин Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Matthew West Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Len Yabloko Re: [ontolog-forum] Is there something I missed?, Len Yabloko