| | 
 Kingsley Idehen wrote:
 
      
      I mean:
            it's a bad thing
            to have apps as data silo vectors.
 
 Yes.  But in my world, many apps are intended to be the master data manager for some part of the
            enterprise.  PLM systems want to be THE integrating
              software for engineering, but they are
                mostly just linked repositories.  But at least someone realized that they
                          need to be linked to all the CAx systems used
                          in engineering, and an effort has been made to
                          make that as painless as possible.  15 years
                          ago, all those CAx systems were separate
                          systems, and documentation management and
                          workflow management and
                            configuration and version
                              management (PLM functions) were also
                              separate systems.  In a
                                similar way ERP systems gathered up
                                    Finance, Procurement,
                                      HR, etc.  So now
                                        what we have are big silos.  I think there will
                                          always be silos in some form.
 
 But the mere fact
                                          that the
                                            enterprise has a handful of
                                            big silos, rather than 25
                                            smaller ones,
                                              makes the problem
                                                more tractable.
 The
                                                          problem with
                                                          25 linked silos
                                                          is transaction
                                                          and
                                                          versioning
                                                          coordination.
 
 
  
 
            > It's so bad that individuals and enterprises are > (today) purchasing computing devices en masse for
            which (as owners) they > don't even posses 'root' privileges.   I think this means that corporations acquire and install
            lots of computers for workers who lack the privileges to do
            system administration.  ... I am referring to the fact that organizations and people are acquiring iOS5 tablets
                    and phones for which they don't have 'root' access.
 
 OH! 
          OK.  I agree that that can be considered a problem.  But it is
          a collision of business models.  The vendor wants to sell you a service, not a product.  The product is
            simply a part of the service, and the supplier can modify the product
                  to improve the service without physical
                    contact with the widely
                        dispersed customers.  The
                          customer thinks he has a product,
                            and if the
                                product can do more or different things
                                from what the supplier provides,
                                  why can't the customer control
                                        the product and make those decisions?  Because it isn't
                                            what he contracted
                                              for.  This is mostly an
                                              education issue -- if you
                                              want to buy and control
                                                    a product and
                                                    negotiate
                                                      for certain
                                                      services, that is
                                                      a
                                                        different business
                                                          model. And if
                                                          ALL the
                                                          service
                                                          providers
                                                          don't want to
                                                          offer that
                                                          option, the
                                                          customer has
                                                          no choice. To
                                                          break that deadlock,
                                                          you
                                                          need a new
                                                          technology that
                                                          offers an
                                                          opportunity
                                                          for startups
                                                          who can offer
                                                          a product/service
                                                          relationship
                                                          the customer
                                                          prefers.
 
 
  
 
           The programmers are a handful of elves in the woods who
            have little influence on any decisions about corporate
            computing. Not so
            since the advent of the Open Source era. An unintended consequence, so to speak.
 
 I think you mistake
        the widespread use of open source software in research
          institutions and software houses for use of open source
        software in industry.  If industry is using open
          source software, it is because the contractor they hired
          installed it.
 
 
  
 
           They just get the job of installing the chosen products
            and making nice screen views for upper management. Pre Web, maybe, In my experience these days -- it's all
              about code first and programming language oriented religious wars.
 
 Again among the programmers in research institutions and software houses.  Most of the population of the Webby
                        exploders is far removed from real
                        applications.  We are only finally beginning to see major software houses and
                              consulting firms using Web
                                technologies in delivered
                                  "solutions", and their
                                    participation in the exploders is primarily
                                      information gathering.
 
 
  
 
            As Steve Fenves, a former Mechanical Engineering chair
            at CMU, observed, "we are finally teaching engineers how to
            use computers instead of how to program
            computers". I wish
          that was my experience. That's exactly how it should be, but not what
              I come across in my travels, unfortunately
                .
 
 Well, Steve did say "finally".  Since that was in 2008 or so, I
    think he probably meant "finally beginning to teach..."
 
 
 
      
 
            > What happened to systems analysts, database
            designers, ontologists etc?   They are well paid consultants or "marketing support"
            staff for software houses.  ... That's how  it
          should be, but  the folks you describe 
          aren't part of the major dialogs
              that occur on the Web, certainly not in the
                quarters that I frequent.
 
 I stand by what I said above.  The folks I describe are the ones in
    my circles.  On most Webby exploders, they are lurkers.  In some
    cases, they are forbidden by company rule to contribute.
 
 
 
      
            > I believe applications are like fish and data like
            wine. The world (in the > majority) still doesn't understand what data
            actually is, let alone the > fundamental implications of such dangerous ignorance
            :-(   I agree 100%.  But that has been so for 50 years.   Yes, but we have
          the eexponential effects
            kicking in these days. Thus, really bad stuff
              ends up affect a lot of people etc..
 
 Well, yes, but certain major vendors and bad but appealing ideas
    have set the industry back 10 years or so at least twice since 1980,
    and that has negatively affected the industry from the outset of the
    Web.  Then again the original design of typewriter keyboards 100
    years ago negatively affects my keyboard productivity even now...
 
 -Ed
 
 
 -- 
Edward J. Barkmeyer                        Email: edbark@xxxxxxxx
National Institute of Standards & Technology
Systems Integration Division, Engineering Laboratory
100 Bureau Drive, Stop 8263                Tel: +1 301-975-3528
Gaithersburg, MD 20899-8263                Cel: +1 240-672-5800
"The opinions expressed above do not reflect consensus of NIST, 
 and have not been reviewed by any Government authority."
 | 
 
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