John, (01)
> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
> Van: ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ontolog-forum-
> bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] Namens John F Sowa
> Verzonden: woensdag 26 september 2012 15:53
> Aan: ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Onderwerp: Re: [ontolog-forum] Universal Basic Semantic Structures
>
> On 9/26/2012 8:53 AM, Andries van Renssen wrote:
> > The reason why the expression 'I dig a hole in the school district'
> > sounds odd is: because that expression is a short-cut for 'I dig
> > a hole in the land that has a role as school district'.
>
> I agree with that point. The notion of role is essential for
> distinguishing every subdivision on planet earth. There is
> always a reason or a purpose for the choice. That is true for
> everything from countries and continents to things like farms,
> parking lots, and playgrounds.
>
> > But the piece of land that is defined by that boundary is
> > nevertheless a physical object, and it has a mass, although
> > its value is unknown and not of interest.
>
> Space is physical, but it doesn't have a mass. An area is
> a two-dimensional region. The political subdivisions only
> specify coordinates that determine the area at the surface,
> and they are silent about depth or height. (02)
[AvR] I hesitate about the mass of a physical space, and whether the gas in
a space is part of the space or just occupies the space. But if the space is
not empty, the mass may be of interest such as in the interior of a balloon
and a submarine.
Design of buildings usually starts with the design of spaces (rooms etc.),
then the walls are added. I consider the spaces to be components of the
building (not as an assembly, but as a component). (03)
I question whether a physical area is by definition two dimensional.
Mathematical area's are two dimensional. But two dimensional area's in
physical reality seem to be abstractions. They are at least curved in the
third dimension. But more important: if you walk on them, they compress
under pressure and they provide an upward force on you. If you buy them then
you also possess a mass with volume below and a space above it, although
constrained nowadays by government rules. Although they are typically
defined in two dimensions only, their third dimension is recognized and
constrained by government rules (as you describe below). (04)
This is related to the concept of 'surface'. A surface can have a roughness,
a color, a hardness, a temperature, a strength, etc. I think that it can't
have such properties when it would be only two dimensional. We are probably
influenced by the abstract mathematical concept of dimensions.
In practical physics, every physical point has a size that is non zero,
although nearly infinitesimal. (05)
>
> By fiat, the governments of countries lay claim to the mineral
> rights beneath their areas. In principle, they could claim rights
> down to the center of the earth. But in practice, the technology
> can only mine a few km. beneath the surface.
>
> When air travel became possible, national governments laid claim
> to the air space above them, but smaller governments did not.
> But nobody laid claim to the regions above the atmosphere.
> Those are more distinctions by fiat.
>
> In summary, I recommend that any ontology for any subdivision
> of the earth should specify the surface area S and the intended
> role R for that area.
[AvR] In some cases (e.g. mines, reservoirs) the subdivision of the earth
requires an explicit third dimension.
And some, such as lakes and mountains, don't need a role. (06)
>
> Then anything else that may be associated with the pair (S,R),
> such as the land, air, water, people, buildings, governments,
> should be specified as the X associated with the area S as
> considered in the role R.
>
> John
>
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