To: | "[ontolog-forum]" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> |
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From: | Doug Skuce <drskuce@xxxxxxxxx> |
Date: | Wed, 27 Apr 2011 11:14:27 -0400 |
Message-id: | <BANLkTi=urOL+YU0c2rwU9E27xz0skjKzgg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> |
On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 8:47 AM, John F. Sowa <sowa@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: Folks, DS: Like Gruber's infamous definition, which included circuit diagrams, house plans, and Beethoven's 5th, this use of "thing" would cover, say, the formal definition of a group in math. But I would not call a group an ontology. But a group HAS an ontology (formal). Whenever people use the 'thing' word, watch out. It carrys no meaning, since "everything is a thing". This suggestion also implies there is no such thing as an informal ontology. But most so-called ontologies to date have been precisely that. So I say there are 2 disjoint kinds: formal (eg SUMO) and informal (eg Wordnet)
DS No, we are talking informal ontology, PROVIDED the term is not isolated but is part of a VOCABULARY (all ontols provide a VOCAB) and some inter-term relationships, starting with narrower-than, are specified. Definitions can be in good NL, logic, or both. If you use the term `formal ontology` and the term `ontology` then either these are synonyms or there exists ìnformal ontology`.. Which do you intend? So here is my take: We must start with a VOCABULARY of 2 or more WORDS (which can be multi-words e.g. `formal ontology` is a multi-word. - there is no standard term for this). If these are in a restricted domain then terminologists call these TERMS.(I have worked closely with terminologists).Thus `formal ontology is a TERM. Probably 'ontology' is not, since it is in common vocabulary, at least for educated people. OTHERWISE they are just LEXICAL ITEMS (ie in any dictionary as a common-sense meaning).'ontology' is such, but it can also be a term when people like us use it in a restricted sense, like the term 'oblect' in programming. As soon as we specify inter-word relations we begin to form an ONTOLOGY. If these are specified using some form of logic, we are forming a formal ontol, else an informal ontol. Note that one could have a mixture: an ontol could be part formal and part informal. So you try to use logic, but when you are stuck you use NL. There is one most critical relationship: narrower-broader, or more precisely, subsumption or hyponomy. Wordnet insists on this. And a word may have more than one more general word: restricting to single parenting does not wash in the real world. Lacking this relation, I would be loath to call a vocabulary an ontology. Ontologists would do well to study the Explanatory Combinatory Dictionary of Igor Melchuk. Such a dictionary is very much an ontology. http://olst.ling.umontreal.ca/melcuk/
DS hey are informal ontologies. Why does everyone call them an ontology? There is a reason - everyone is not crazy. You are conflating the term 'ontology' with 'formal ontology'
DS Yes, but what is your point? What is to be done with them? Cant just ignore a large chunk of language.
DS Ditto
Of course there are terms - you cant have an ontology without a vocabuary.
DS You have been confusing 'ontology' with one of its two meanings. You are suggesting 'terminology' = 'informal ontology'. But a formal ontology HAS a vocabulary too. The term 'terminology' has a precise meaning when used by terminologists. Please check this out. We should get this clear, because this conflation of terms is at the root of the problem
-- Doug Skuce PhD (Univ of Ottawa) 21 Torrington Pl Ottawa K1S 4E2 613 526 3732 _________________________________________________________________ Message Archives: http://ontolog.cim3.net/forum/ontolog-forum/ Config Subscr: http://ontolog.cim3.net/mailman/listinfo/ontolog-forum/ Unsubscribe: mailto:ontolog-forum-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Shared Files: http://ontolog.cim3.net/file/ Community Wiki: http://ontolog.cim3.net/wiki/ To join: http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?WikiHomePage#nid1J (01) |
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