Is a bishopric monitored for compliance? By who or what?
What remedies (resilience) are applicable to a bishopric?
On Feb 1, 2012, at 12:00 AM, doug foxvog wrote: (01)
>>> what happens when the next person gets instantiated as the (same) bishop?
>
>> Here is one take on it (without mentioning 4D?)
>> The role of bishop of Liverpool was used by Person A for time-period 100.
>> That role may be used by Person B for the next time period 101. You
>> may identify this triple relationship as you wish.
>
> We are talking about three things, not two, the corporation sole, the
> role of bishop, and the person who occupies the role of bishop for a
> given bishopric.
>
> The Bishopric is an intangible individual (like a corporation) that can
> own property and has been granted authority to perform certain kinds
> of acts.
>
> A Person while performing the role of Bishop, has the derived authority
> to perform the actions which the Bishopric is permitted. This is the
> same as any other corporate officer being permitted to act in the name
> of her corporation when authorized.
>
> -- doug f
>
>
>> Regards,
>> Gary
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 31, 2012 at 5:57 PM, Chris Partridge
>> <partridgec@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> wrote:
>>
>>> It looks like you are describing something similar to a qua object,
>>> which
>>> has no identity.****
>>>
>>> Not sure we are talking about the same thing. Bishop in this case is a
>>> particular bishop, such as the ‘Bishop of Liverpool’ – a corporation
>>> sole,
>>> a legal person. If we take the approach you suggest, what happens when
>>> the
>>> next person gets instantiated as the (same) bishop. In what sense is it
>>> the
>>> ‘same’ bishop – the bishop continues to own the land, etc.****
>>>
>>> Wouldn’t Occam’s razor prefer a simple agent.****
>>>
>>> ** **
>>>
>>> Regards,****
>>>
>>> Chris ****
>>>
>>> ** **
>>>
>>> *From:* ontology-summit-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:
>>> ontology-summit-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] *On Behalf Of *Gary Berg-Cross
>>> *Sent:* 31 January 2012 21:47
>>>
>>> *To:* Ontology Summit 2012 discussion
>>> *Subject:* Re: [ontology-summit] System Components****
>>>
>>> ** **
>>>
>>> Chris,
>>>
>>> Chris noted>I find it odd that a qua object can own property, have
>>> responsibilities, declare war (Monarchs), etc. – which the person cannot
>>> do.
>>>
>>> Thematic roles may be thought of as a set of types when objects
>>> participate in processes. There is a general notion of the role, but it
>>> gets instantiated in an object, such as a person who has a bishop role
>>> and
>>> thus participates in the bishop processes.****
>>>
>>> Gary Berg-Cross, Ph.D. ****
>>>
>>> gbergcross@xxxxxxxxx ****
>>>
>>> http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?GaryBergCross****
>>>
>>> NSF INTEROP Project ****
>>>
>>> http://www.nsf.gov/awardsearch/showAward.do?AwardNumber=0955816 ****
>>>
>>> SOCoP Executive Secretary****
>>>
>>> Knowledge Strategies ****
>>>
>>> Potomac, MD****
>>>
>>> 240-426-0770****
>>>
>>> ** **
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 31, 2012 at 1:05 PM, Chris Partridge <
>>> partridgec@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:****
>>>
>>> You will find references to ‘bishop’ in the article.****
>>>
>>> I understand that Nicola and Giancarlo (and others) would regard
>>> ‘bishop’
>>> as a role, qua object, etc.****
>>>
>>> Historically this ‘role’ was introduced to ensure that legal title to
>>> property given to the church remained with the bishop (corporation sole)
>>> rather than inherited by his kin. It was then extended to monarchs.****
>>>
>>> I find it odd that a qua object can own property, have responsibilities,
>>> declare war (Monarchs), etc. – which the person cannot do.****
>>>
>>> I also cannot see how this would work if the corporation sole did not
>>> have
>>> some kind of identity.****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> *From:* ontology-summit-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:
>>> ontology-summit-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] *On Behalf Of *Jack Ring
>>> *Sent:* 31 January 2012 13:24****
>>>
>>>
>>> *To:* Ontology Summit 2012 discussion
>>> *Subject:* Re: [ontology-summit] System Components****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> I do not find 'role' mentioned in the given URL regarding 'sole'****
>>>
>>> Elsewhere in widipedia is "role posits the following about social
>>> behaviour: #3. Roles are occupied by individuals, who are called
>>> actors<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Actors>
>>> ."****
>>>
>>> Overall It seems that role specifies a location in a coordinate system,
>>> not an operator such as actor.****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> Seems to me that the ****
>>>
>>> On Jan 31, 2012, at 1:50 AM, Chris Partridge wrote:****
>>>
>>> ** **
>>>
>>> One sense, for another see e.g.
>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporation_sole****
>>>
>>> ‘role’ covers a wide variety of meanings****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> *From:* ontology-summit-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:
>>> ontology-summit-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] *On Behalf Of *Jack Ring
>>> *Sent:* 30 January 2012 23:33
>>> *To:* Ontology Summit 2012 discussion
>>> *Subject:* Re: [ontology-summit] System Components****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> According to David Taylor, Object Technology for Managers, role is
>>> simply
>>> an authorization to act, not the operator that acts. Operators inherit
>>> roles then process operands accordingly. ****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> On Jan 30, 2012, at 3:50 PM, Nicola Guarino wrote:****
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> Dear Matthew, ****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> just a few clarifications concerning my lab's work. Note that
>>> I
>>> am just trying to catch up with the (main points of the) discussion, and
>>> I
>>> am probably missing many things. I look forward to seeing the discussion
>>> synthesised somewhere, in order to allow everybody to understand how we
>>> progress.****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> Matthew West writes (answering to Giancarlo Guizzardi):****
>>>
>>> An alternative to this issue can be thought of by considering qua
>>> individuals (e.g.http://www.loa.istc.cnr.it/Papers/KR04MasoloC.pdf)****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> MW: This is very similar to the 4D, but is relatively opaque, and gives
>>> more individuals than if you adopt extensional identity in 4D. In this
>>> case
>>> playing multiple roles simultaneously does not give multiple states, but
>>> one state playing multiple roles. A bit more elegant I think.****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> or perspectiles
>>>
>http://www.loa.istc.cnr.it/Papers/BottazziFerrarioPerspectilesEuroCogSciv.pdf
>>> ). ****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> MW: This seems to generalise the idea above a bit. One problem I have
>>> with
>>> both of these is that (if I understand it correctly) they treat social
>>> and
>>> other roles as purely classes. This gives me a problem if I want to
>>> shake
>>> the hand of the president, or start P101, because classes are abstract,
>>> and
>>> these are just things you can’t do to them. This is central to what I
>>> find
>>> unsatisfactory with these kinds of approaches. The situation is confused
>>> by
>>> there being several different meanings to role, from the participant
>>> role
>>> in an activity or state, to the component in a system, or social role
>>> with
>>> significant differences in character between them.****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> The second paper is still work in progress, while the first one is more
>>> established. In both cases, however, for sure the approach does not only
>>> admit roles as "pure classes", and new kinds of individuals are
>>> introduced.
>>> I defend a similar, although slightly different approach in the paper
>>> below, which explicitly considers the parts replacement problem (among
>>> other things) by introducing the notion of a "virtual individual" (NOTE
>>> -
>>> this is still a draft - comments welcome):****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7903842/Guarino-FunctionalPartsFunctionalRoles.pdf
>>> ****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> Best,****
>>>
>>> ****
>>>
>>> Nicola****
>>>
>>>
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>>> -- ****
>>>
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>>
>>
>> --
>> Gary Berg-Cross, Ph.D.
>> gbergcross@xxxxxxxxx
>> http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?GaryBergCross
>> NSF INTEROP Project
>> http://www.nsf.gov/awardsearch/showAward.do?AwardNumber=0955816
>> SOCoP Executive Secretary
>> Knowledge Strategies
>> Potomac, MD
>> 240-426-0770
>>
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