This reminds me. This group had started work on an n-ary paper years ago. I’ll see if I can find it and if it is relevant.
D
On 2/5/10 3:14 AM, "Sjir Nijssen" <sjir.nijssen@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Dear Matthew,
Thanks for the answer.
Could you indicate how many relationships were used? And were they all binary, or did you include n-aries?
Kind regards
Sjir
From: ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx on behalf of Matthew West
Sent: Fri 2/5/2010 12:09 PM
To: '[ontolog-forum] '
Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Foundation ontology, CYC, and Mapping
Dear Sjir,
This was a conceptual data model, so attributes were not a focus. However, ISO 15926 and the Shell DDM were designed to be data driven, so there were very few attributes. Most things that would usually be modelled as attributes were modelled as relationships to entity types. So the model was meaningfully instantiable.
Regards
Matthew West
Information Junction
Tel: +44 560 302 3685
Mobile: +44 750 3385279
matthew.west@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:matthew.west@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
http://www.informationjunction.co.uk/ <http://www.informationjunction.co.uk/>
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This email originates from Information Junction Ltd. Registered in England and Wales No. 6632177.
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From: ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Sjir Nijssen
Sent: 05 February 2010 09:21
To: [ontolog-forum] ; [ontolog-forum]
Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Foundation ontology, CYC, and Mapping
Dear Matthew,
Very interesting figures.
Could you tell us how many properties or attributes were associated with the 1700 entity types?
Kind regards
Sjir Nijssen
From: ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx on behalf of Matthew West
Sent: Fri 2/5/2010 10:13 AM
To: '[ontolog-forum] '
Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Foundation ontology, CYC, and Mapping
Dear Ed and Dave,
Quite.
> > P.S. I realize that by guessing at what Dave meant, I may be
> > constructing the strawman I am knocking down. My apologies if I am
> > well
> > wide of the mark.
> [DMc] It's not perfect, but I don't see why you wouldn't start with an
> FO that has been rigorously debated and disambiguated as a starting
> point. Our experience is that it was useful.
MW: As another example, about 5 years ago when I was still working for Shell
I was charged with developing a conceptual data model for Shell's Downstream
business (oil tanker to petrol pump). We started with ISO 15926 as a
foundation ontology, and developed a 1700 entity type data model in 12
months with a team of ten people. This would normally just not work:
- A team of ten people will usually fail to agree on how to model things,
- If you let ten people model independently different areas they will come
up with incompatible models,
- If you have a team of 2-3 people it will take a lot longer than a year to
produce 1700 entity types.
Because we had a foundation ontology that we had confidence in as an
analysis framework we did not suffer these problems.
I presented the project at a DAMA conference and one of our major
competitors was present. After the presentation I asked what they thought
such a model would cost them to develop. They said $5m. It actually cost
$1m.
Whether foundation ontologies play much role in reasoning, is I think rather
to miss the point.
Regards
Matthew West
Information Junction
Tel: +44 560 302 3685
Mobile: +44 750 3385279
matthew.west@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://www.informationjunction.co.uk/
http://www.matthew-west.org.uk/
This email originates from Information Junction Ltd. Registered in England
and Wales No. 6632177.
Registered office: 2 Brookside, Meadow Way, Letchworth Garden City,
Hertfordshire, SG6 3JE.
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