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Re: [ontolog-forum] Just What Is an Ontology, Anyway?

To: "'[ontolog-forum] '" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
From: "Rich Cooper" <rich@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Wed, 28 Oct 2009 18:02:29 -0700
Message-id: <20091029010325.01216138D20@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

So it looks like the consensus among those in this discussion is:

 

An ontology is a collection of

 

classes, each with possibly unique property values;

 

a few constant instances (e.g., equilateral triangle = special instance of generalized triangle, etc);

and

logical relationships among the classes and instances.

 

And nothing else.  If that satisfies everyone, then any operational system would require more than just an ontology.  It would also require that information nobody seems to want to call ontological, like the specific employees in the employee table.  

 

If we accept this definition among the group of us, an ontology with a database to back it would be about the simplest semantic system I can imagine being useful.  The database would store the instance data beyond the ontology, but the ontology would define the classes, properties and relationships among the entities.  

 

But then how do we account for the diverse viewpoints going into the system from multiple users?  We all agree that each user has a unique ontology of her personal world.  We know that subjectivity gets squeezed into the tightest databases with the strictest controls.  

 

So how do we account for personal ontologies in a semantic system?

 

Curiously,

-Rich

 

Sincerely,

Rich Cooper

EnglishLogicKernel.com

Rich AT EnglishLogicKernel DOT com

 

-----Original Message-----
From: ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of John Bottoms
Sent: Wednesday, October 28, 2009 5:24 PM
To: [ontolog-forum]
Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Just What Is an Ontology, Anyway?

 

Rich,

 

Sounds reasonable. After all, I can point to a set of

encyclopedias on the shelf and say, "That's my encyclopedia".

But in what way is it more than just 32 bindings A-Z?

There definitely is a sense in which an ontology is just a

set of leather bound books...at least for some. My interests

go beyond that.

 

-John Bottoms

Concord, MA

 

Rich Cooper wrote:

 

> Doug, you have suggested that ontology is just the set of categories,

> i.e. classes, with properties and behaviors, with sets and subset

> relationships among them, but WITHOUT the entire framework of an

> operational model with full structure; not a model capable of simulating

> the world. 

>

>

> Sort of like a library of classes that has been done once and for all. 

> Now that we have this hypothetical ontology available in the library,

> the classes thereof can be instantiated to make such a simulation of the

> world by further effort.  But that is a whole nother project.

>

>

> For example, a library of electrical components can be built and might

> contain resistors, capacitors, transistors, sensors, effectors, but no

> diagram of a Dolby stereo surround sound system.  Then I could build a

> Dolby stereo surround sound system by instantiating the right components

> and building a simulation of the Dolby equations as interpreted in the

> library of components.  Kinda indirect (easier jus to simulate the

> equations without using electrical analogies of the equations) but you

> get the analogy I’m trying to make, I hope. 

>

>

> If an ontology is a set of classes, then it provides a library of

> functionality.

>

>

> If an ontology is a set of classes with a model of a world structured on

> top of it, then it provides a specific application of the library, along

> with that library itself. 

>

>

> Which one is it?  I vote for the library kind of definition for

> ontology.  Anyone have a divergent view to offer?  Surely someone can

> reasonably justify defining ontology as the full model including

> simulation. 

>

>

> -Rich

>

>

> Sincerely,

>

> Rich Cooper

>

> EnglishLogicKernel.com

>

> Rich AT EnglishLogicKernel DOT com

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

> From: ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

> [mailto:ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Burkett,

> William [USA]

> Sent: Wednesday, October 28, 2009 10:23 AM

> To: [ontolog-forum]

> Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Just What Is an Ontology, Anyway?

>

>

>>What George E.P. Box said about models (“All models are wrong, but some

> are useful.”) is true for ontologies as well.

>

>>AA: Wrong. This is the whole point of ontology to create true models of

> the world, formal and informal, analytic and desciptive.

>

>

> Andreas is right, Azamat.  An ontology is a model and inherits all the

> limitations of any other model of the world.  Models are at best

> incomplete representation of the world.  There is no such thing as a

> single “true” representation of any aspect of the world.  In fact, I

> think “true” is a red herring; the most desirable (if not only)

> objective for a model is fidelity and accuracy with respect to purpose.

>

>

> Bill

>

>

>

> From: ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

> [mailto:ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of

> AzamatAbdoullaev

> Sent: Wednesday, October 28, 2009 10:40 AM

> To: [ontolog-forum]

> Cc: vasile.mazilescu@xxxxxxx; semantic-web@xxxxxx

> Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Just What Is an Ontology, Anyway?

>

>

> Responding to the seemingly eternal question: what is ontology? I

> suggest a simple answer, the World Desciption Framework, WDF, giving

> basic meanings to information, and incorporating all the generic and

> specific schemas and models and theories,like RDF, E-R Model, upper

> ontologies, CL, common metadata models, OO models, UML, etc.

>

> What also concerns: we hotly discuss the same issues on <what ontology

> and semantic web might be> for a rather long time trying to set the

> frontier of the research, while the "periphery" is coming up with really

> innovative ideas (see the attached PDF Doc on the Intelligent Knowledge

> Management and Universal Knowledge Technology from Romania).

>

> Azamat Abdoullaev

>

> http://standardontology.com

>

> PS: If we are aimed at semantic interoperability, it would be good to

> try the concept from the exchange of information between the two closed

> fora, SW and Ontolog.

>

>     ----- Original Message -----

>

>     From: Tolk, Andreas <mailto:atolk@xxxxxxx>

>

>     To: '[ontolog-forum] ' <mailto:ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

>

>     Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2009 8:53 PM

>

>     Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Just What Is an Ontology, Anyway?

>

>     

>

>     This viewpoint is not completely new to everyone. In particular in

>     the modeling & simulation community, the idea that each model

>     represents – very similar to an ontology – a viewpoint needed to

>     address a given challenge (the model was build to help solving a

>     problem, and the viewpoint needed to solve the problem becomes the

>     viewpoint of the model) becomes predominant. Each model is a

>     purposeful abstraction and simplification of reality, again similar

>     to an ontology.

>

>     AA: Right.

>

>     What George E.P. Box said about models (“All models are wrong, but

>     some are useful.”) is true for ontologies as well.

>

>     AA: Wrong. This is the whole point of ontology to create true models

>     of the world, formal and informal, analytic and desciptive.

>

>     

>

>     iIn other words: each ontology contributes a different facet to a

>     description, and in order to get the whole picture, all facets are

>     needed.

>

>     The only common ontology description integrating everything is the

>     world

>

>     AA: Here is the confusion of the universe of discourse and the

>     discourse itself. See on the WDF above.

>

>     (if we exclude imagination of what could be to make the problem a

>     little bit easier), but we could not use the world to answer our

>     problem in the first place, that is why we developed a simpler model

>     for our use.

>

>     Long story short: we do not need a common ontology,

>

>     AA: that's a strategic mistake.

>

>     but we need a common way to describe our work allowing the mediation

>     of viewpoints. As our worldviews differ in scope (what we look at),

>     resolution (detail we are looking at), and structure (categorization

>     of what we are looking at), these mediations will not always be

>     loss-free, but that is part of the nature of the beast.

>

>     It seems like we are starting to come to very similar observations

>     and reach mappable conclusions in different scientific domains.

>

>     

>

>     Andreas

>

>     

>

>      

>

>     From: ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

>     [mailto:ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of

>     Burkett, William [USA]

>     Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2009 2:30 PM

>     To: [ontolog-forum]

>     Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] Just What Is an Ontology, Anyway?

>

>     

>

>     Bravo, Rich – this is the first time I’ve heard anyone in any of

>     these ontology/SUO forums stress so strongly the human-factor aspect

>     of data semantics.   I’ve been trying to argue this point for years

>     but to most CS-trained individuals it just falls on deaf ears.   I

>     even have a nice little catchy name for the theory:  “Data Is

>     Speech”.    As you suggest, there will be multiple ontologies (or

>     whatever you want to call them) to formally represent different

>     views of the word and they will need to be quickly adaptable to

>     changing business requirements .  And the one significant missing

>     and way way underserved ingredient is mapping and translation

>     technology.

>

>     

>

>     Bill

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

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