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Re: [ontolog-forum] An Ultra High Level Ontology - ISO15926 & Fly in the

To: "'[ontolog-forum] '" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
From: Matthew West <dr.matthew.west@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 20:26:43 -0000
Message-id: <499334ad.1ac1f10a.3527.564b@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Dear Pat,    (01)

> > Some ontology developers have no criteria for identity at all. In an
> > intensional ontology, it is OK to have the types Equiangular
> > Triangle and
> > Equilateral Triangle. It isn't OK in an extensional ontology like
> > ISO15926,
> > BORO or IDEAS, because there is only one extent defined by both
> > terms.We
> > are also ruthlessly extensional on individuals - if two things have
> > the same
> > spatial and temporal extent, they are the same thing.
> That isn't what 'extensional' means. Everything would be a lot easier
> if y'all used the terminology properly. But why do you think that
> strict extensionality (in your sense, here) is so desirable? What is
> the advantage to all this extensional rigor?     (02)

[MW] It saves all the argument about one persons intuitions vs another
persons intuitions as to whether there is or is not a figment of their
imagination, or whatever.    (03)

> Seems on the face of
> things that there can be more than one way to describe a given piece
> of space/time, eg the famous example of a vase being also a chunk of
> plastic, yet having properties (like, being a vase) that the chunk of
> plastic doesn't have.    (04)

[MW] Well actually that piece of plastic does precisely have the property of
being a vase, what else is there to be the vase but the piece of plastic?
Now very often the piece of plastic will have a longer life than the vase,
and there will be two distinct spatio-temporal extents. However, when they
have (accidentally) the same spatio-temporal extent, they will equally
accidentally share all their properties, so it will be no problem that they
are actually just one object.
> >
> >
> > It's no good having everyone agree to use the UHLO (I think the
> > acronym
> > could catch on !), if they all have a different understanding of
> > what the
> > categories map onto in the real world.
> >
> > We (Matthew, Chris and I) use this extensional approach because
> > we're in the
> > dirty business of data integration - we have to deal with real stuff
> > in
> > transactional systems.
> So why does data integration require extensionality (in your sense,
> here)?    (05)

[MW] It's only pragmatic. It's the worst way to build an ontology (apart
from all the others).    (06)

Regards    (07)

Matthew West                            
Information  Junction
Tel: +44 560 302 3685
Mobile: +44 750 3385279
http://www.matthew-west.org.uk/    (08)

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