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Re: [ontolog-forum] {Disarmed} Reality and Truth

To: "[ontolog-forum]" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
From: Ingvar Johansson <ingvar.johansson@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 09:48:20 +0200
Message-id: <46514EC4.4010109@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
KCliffer@xxxxxxx schrieb:
> My responses to Ingvar (essentially agreement, with a bit of 
> explanation) are embedded below.
>  
> ingvar.johansson@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx writes:
>
>     I am happy to join what I take to be your agreement on the concept of
>     truth. Let me just test my understanding.
>
>     In one of her mails, Paola wrote: "Truth (like falseness) is a
>     quality
>     of a statement or assertion about reality." 
>
> [Not that it matters, but I think I (Ken) wrote (get the blame 
> for) that statement.]
>
>     In philosophical ontology, it
>     is sometimes necessary to distinguish between *monadic qualities* and
>     *relational qualities*. The quality of "being a sphere" is monadic; 
>     when there is an instance of sphericity it simply inheres in a thing.
>     The quality of "being more spherelike than the Earth", on the other
>     hand, is a relational quality. If we claim "Venus is more spherelike
>     than the Earth", then we claim not only that Venus has a certain
>     shape,
>     we also claim that this shape stands in a certain *relationship* to
>     another shape. Now, what has this distinction with the truth
>     concept to do?
>
>     In my understanding of Ken's nice exposition, truth as a "quality
>     of a
>     statement" cannot possibly be a monadic quality, it has to be a
>     *relational quality*; it must bring in a relation of correspondence
>     between the statement and something that ought to be called a
>     *truthmaker*. To claim that a statement is completely true is to
>     claim
>     that it has a relation of complete correspondence to a truthmaker; to
>     claim that it is truthlike is to claim that it has a relation of
>     partial
>     correspondence to a truthmaker.
>
>     Do you (at least Ken and Paola) agree?
>
> I think I agree, with a few qualifications or caveats with respect to 
> my view of it.
>  
> 1) One can, I think, consider the truth not only of a statement, but 
> of a (the) mental model associated with the statement, as a statement 
> is typically an expression of a mental model of reality. The two (the 
> statement and the associated mental model it expresses) can be 
> considered themselves to be corresponding.    (01)

I have used the term "statement" in such a way that a statement contains 
both a sentence (as a pure graphical or oral sign) and a proposition 
(mental or Platonic). I have no qualms about talk of models 
corresponding or not corresponding to reality.    (02)

>  
> 2) The "truthmaker" as I interpret Ingvar's invocation of it would be 
> the aspect of reality that the statement is about and that the mental 
> model associated with the statement represents.    (03)

Yes, this is the way I meant it.    (04)

>  
> 3) The relation is the degree of correspondence between the model or 
> statement expressing it and the reality; no correspondence means 
> falseness, complete correspondence means truth, and partial 
> correspondence means partial truth.
>  
> 4) I agree with Ingvar's last statement about complete and partial 
> truth, with the caveat that it may be difficult or impossible to 
> assess the level of truth in a meaningful absolute way. However, 
> science does it in a relative way of checking correspondence of the 
> statement or model with observations associated with the reality, 
> considered using logical reasoning. To the degree to which the 
> statement or model accurately expresses or predicts the observations 
> or results of experiments considered to "test" its validity (truth), 
> it is considered to be true. But science always leaves room for a 
> better-performing model that can be demonstrated to be "more true" by 
> a better correspondence with observations, including observations that 
> may not have been considered initially in association with the 
> statement or model.    (05)

I agree with the caveat.    (06)

>  
> 5) However, as I indicated previously, some statements are so clearly 
> agreed to represent reality accurately when understood as intended, 
> that we can have a high degree of confidence in their "truth".
>
>     PS. Many contemporary philosophers do (I am sad to report) have
>     the view
>     that truth is a monadic quality of statements (propositions).
>
> I don't specifically know what you're referring to, but it's hard to 
> imagine how a statement could have a truth value without considering 
> that it itself is an expression of a mental construct (thought) for 
> which the truth depends on its status with respect to the thing it's 
> referring to. Even if it's an assumption for heuristic purposes, it's 
> still relational - it's declared to correspond to a manufactured 
> reality (mental model) being considered. The referent, as far as I can 
> see, must be something separate from the statement or model it 
> expresses, which could include (as some have pointed out) people's 
> mental models or other statements about reality.    (07)

I have the same "imagination problems". However, here is a list of 
philosophers that I had in mind:
1. Michael Dummett and his followers, who argue that a "fact" should be 
*defined* as "a true proposition", i.e., when a proposition has the 
monadic property of being true, then there is a fact.
2. The so-called "identity theory of truth" (J. Hornsby, J. Dodd), 
according to which truthberarer (proposition) and truthmaker are 
*identical*.
3. Jonathan Lowe, "The Four-Category Ontology" (2006), in a way that 
differs from  both of those mentioned above.    (08)

Ingvar    (09)

>  
> Ken
>  
> Kenneth Cliffer, Ph.D.
>
>
>
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>
>  
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>       (010)


-- 
Ingvar Johansson
IFOMIS, Saarland University
     home site: http://ifomis.org/
     personal home site:
     http://hem.passagen.se/ijohansson/index.html      (011)



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