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--- "system of systems" (a group of
interrelated but independent systems making a whole)
--- "collection
of systems" (several systems considered as a whole)
--- "aggregation of
systems" (several systems considered as a whole)
--- "group of systems"
(any number of systems considered as a whole)
--- "set of systems" (a
group of systems of the same kind)
--- "association of systems" (a
relation of systems resulting from dependence or interaction)
The system of systems (SoS) draws an
enormous interest, theoretical and practical. It's most important to specify
this key type of complex systems, together with metasystems, their distinctions,
definitions and meanings, scope, and properties and applications.
The system of systems research,
egineering and applications are among priority projects in research
institutions, government agencies and commercial entities, as MIT, DoD,
NASA.
Ontology is fully capable to provide
fundamental principles, reference standards, and formal methodology for the
SoS engineering and applications, which are just as many as the networks of
heterogenous systems of all sorts and types.
Azamat Abdoullaev
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2012 6:47
PM
Subject: Re: [ontology-summit] Ontology
Summit process [was-Re:[BigSystemsand SE] summit session-03]
Is anyone making a distinction among:
--- "system of
systems"
--- "collection of systems"
---
"aggregation of systems"
--- "group of systems"
---
"set of systems"
--- "association of systems?"
Joe
On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 8:05 AM, Christopher
Spottiswoode <cms@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Already a preliminary P.S. on that
thought:
Hobbes' Leviathan was first published 360 years
ago. But we may surely presume we aren't full circle back to
Hobbesian strong central government, here in the form of excessive reliance
on any central ontology.
Even though the Babel, like Leviathan, has
biblical sanction.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2012 5:37
PM
Subject: Re: [ontology-summit]
Ontology Summit process [was-Re:[BigSystemsand SE] summit
session-03]
Ah, thank you Azamat, for the nice
metaphor.
As long as we beware the "Leviathan"
associations.
A thought relevant, I believe, to the entire Summit
theme.
(More on which anon.)
Christopher
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2012
5:14 PM
Subject: Re: [ontology-summit]
Ontology Summit process [was -Re:[BigSystemsand SE] summit
session-03]
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2012
4:24 PM
Subject: Re: [ontology-summit]
Ontology Summit process [was -Re:[Big Systemsand SE] summit
session-03]
Azamat,
Sorry, I can't resist answering your
question:
> What is a master-planned
and well-designed city:
> systems of systems or
big systems?
Definitely your first alternative. The
second is either non-existent or a nightmare.
Of course, any such system of systems also has
to be very loosely-knit and dynamically-conceived.
AA: Ideally, to mimic the human organism, as
in "smart cities":
-
eco infrastructure (skeleton frame),
-
logistics and utilities, water supply, energy
networks, and wastage system (body processes, intake, respiration,
digestion, excreting),
-
digital ICT (telecommunications) networks (the
nerves),
-
transportation and mobility (locomotion),
-
embedded intelligence (the brains),
-
sensors and tags (the sensory organs),
-
intelligent software (the knowledge and
cognitive competence).
Regards,
Azamat
Respectfully,
Christopher
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, January 27, 2012
8:00 PM
Subject: Re: [ontology-summit]
Ontology Summit process [was -Re:[Big Systems and SE] summit
session-03]
What is a master-planned and well-designed
city: systems of systems or big systems?
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, January 27,
2012 7:16 PM
Subject: Re:
[ontology-summit] Ontology Summit process [was - Re:[Big Systems
and SE] summit session-03]
The
engineers I work with commonly refer to “systems of systems”
instead of “big systems.” Systems of systems are, as the name
suggests, are collections of coordinated systems. The most common
variety are network-centric systems.
Outside
the engineering world – and in it, for that matter – the common
phrase is “complex systems.”
The
chief difference between systems and systems of systems, aside
from scale, is increased interest in emergent behaviors and the
application of hierarchy theories.
--
Jeff Schiffel
-------------------------------------------------------
From: Arun
Majumdar
FWIW: I consider "Big Systems" distinct
from "Systems Engineering" in that "Big Systems" are about size,
depth, breadth and complexity from an ontological, teleological
and epistemological schemes for naming, categorization,
management, curation, lifecycle and operations viewpoint.
Systems Engineering, in my viewpoint, is about engineering
methodologies, tools, techniques, approaches, strategies,
cookbooks, and data/information/infrastructure
architectures.
On Jan 27, 2012, at 11:46 AM, joseph simpson
wrote:
Thanks, this kind
of organizational detail helps.
If the objective of the
summit activity is to make a distinction between "big systems" and
"systems engineering" then combining the tracks would make the
identification of that distinction more difficult.
I
believe this primary distinction is important.
However, I
agree that combining the tracks will not stop discussion. It will
just eliminate the requirement to make a "best guess"
categorization of area to place the topic. Discussion of
this fundamental selection would enable the communication of each
individuals point of view.
For example, I would have placed
the discussion of Cyc in Big Systems, not Systems
Engineering. I would place the earth weather system in Big
Systems, not Systems Engineering.
I would place the
discussion of component engineering languages in the Systems
Engineering area but would call it concurrent component
engineering, not systems engineering. There is a difference
between distributed, concurrent component engineering and Systems
Engineering.
But that just my take on the domain areas,
other views are just as valid at this level.
Have
fun,
Joe
On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 8:27 AM, Peter Yim
<peter.yim@xxxxxxxx> wrote:
Seeing JackRing, JosephSimpson,
TerryLongstreth, etc.'s misgivings
about the announcement on
"combining the tracks 1&2", (and even
JohnSowa's use of
"track" in his suggestion that we look at Cyc) I
believe
we need some clarification on the following really means,
in
terms of the OntologySummit process.
This is my
take on the matter ...
* Track - a broadstroke
partitioning of various sub-focus under the
theme, which allows
us to cluster and manage the OntologySummit
discourse more
effectively
** Track Title - a label that broadly describes
what a particular track covers
** Track Mission - a
statement describing what a particular track
intends to achieve
(and possibly a bit on how it intends to do it)
** Track
champion - volunteers who are committing a lot of time
and
effort to help get things organized (within a track),
moderate the
discussions, host virtual panel sessions, and who
will, eventually
help synthesize the inputs, contributions and
learnings from the
community that were channeled to a
particular track
* (virtual) Session - the weekly 2-hour
virtual (augmented conference
call) events that are featured
during the 3-months while the
OntologSummit is in session.
These are (nominally) chaired and
organized by the track
champions. Because of the time limitation,
there will only be
about a dozen of these. Depending on the number of
tracks there
are, each track ends up getting only one or two of
these
sessions. These are the occasions where summit
participants get to
interact synchronously. Participants are
invited to offer to present
briefs of relevance (by sending a
title and an abstract of what they
want to present to the track
champions for consideration), or just
come to the sessions, and
share their insights (which will get
documented and archived)
in real time.
* (discussion) Thread / Subject - discussions
made over the
[ontology-summit] mailing list. These are usually
jump-started, and
coordinated by track champions. Topics can
also be initiated by anyone
in the OntologySummit community
(i.e. those who are subscribed to that
particular mailing list)
as long as they are relevant to the Summit
theme; and, of
course, preferably relevant to a particular track
mission.
Participants are requested to properly prefix and label
a
discussion thread's subject line to make it easier for
everyone (and
for those who will be trying to synthesize the
transactions.)
Contributions should stay on topic, an if the
discussion is taking off
in a new direction, the contributor
should also modify the subject
line as appropriate. This is the
most generally used platform, with no
(within reason) limits
(other than the contributors' time and
imagination), and works
asynchronously among the OntologySummit
participants.
*
CommunityInput and Synthesis wiki-pages for the tracks - this
is,
presumably, self-explanatory. see:
http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?OntologySummit2012#nid309C
...
under "Workspaces"
* Constraints - there are a lot that can
be done, but only some will
get done because we are constraint
by time (~3 months) and the limited
volunteered resources.
Therefore, if anyone is passionate about seeing
a particular
aspect properly addressed, please volunteer yourself to
help
drive it.
So, (my take again) ...
- Did we
'kill' the distinction between "systems engineering"
and
"engineered systems" by combining the two tracks? ... I
don't think
so. Those discussion threads are still alive and
kicking on the
[ontology-summit] list and in the in-session
chat inputs. No one is
(or can) call a stop to them.
-
Did we "kill" any discussion? ... not by way or combining
or
relabeling the tracks; but with the posting of the new
track-1&2
mission statement, the focus should now be very
clearly defined, and
one can better see where the champions
would want to see the
discussions be directed.
- Can we
start a "track on Cyc"? ... probably not (any more) at
this
stage; and given the constraints, even having a "session
just on Cyc"
may not be the most appropriate. However,
JohnSowa's call to our
paying attention to Cyc and discuss what
we are learning from it, is a
absolutely brilliant idea.
Input into that thread John just started
will help move
the discussion forward. I'm sure Cyc has material that
is
relevant to any and all of our tracks, and various track
champions
can consider addressing certain aspects in one of
their virtual
sessions. Getting those activities properly
coordinated would be the
organizing committee's job (which the
various co-champions can
discuss, offline, in the organizing
committee meetings or on their
[ontology-summit-org]
list.)
Regards. =ppy
--
On Fri, Jan 27,
2012 at 6:18 AM, Jack Ring <jring7@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Having
combined two distinct topics into one track you now ask that we
deselect our sub-topics to fit the limited bandwidth. Will this
arrive at a compelling summit in April?
> On Jan 27,
2012, at 2:01 AM, Matthew West wrote:
>
>>
Gentlemen,
>> Thank you very much for your contributions
yesterday. Your talks obviously
>> raised considerable
interest.
>>
>> If there is a problem, it is
that there is just too much material to go at
>> in the
remainder of the Ontology Summit on this track. So I would ask
you
>> each to nominate just two focussed topics from the
discussions last night,
>> that you would like to see
progress made during the rest of the
summit.
>>
>> Mine are:
>> - Ontology
of System Components
>> - Design Language
Interoperability
>>
>>
>>
Regards
>>
>> Matthew West
>>
Information Junction
>> Tel: +44 1489
880185
>> Mobile: +44 750 3385279
>> Skype:
dr.matthew.west
>> matthew.west@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>
http://www.informationjunction.co.uk/
>>
http://www.matthew-west.org.uk/
>>
>>
This email originates from Information Junction Ltd. Registered in
England
>> and Wales No. 6632177.
>> Registered
office: 2 Brookside, Meadow Way, Letchworth Garden
City,
>> Hertfordshire, SG6
3JE.
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Sent From My DROID!!
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