Re: [ontolog-forum] [OT]: No confidential or private messages on this op

["Rich Cooper" <rich@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Dear Peter and Duane,

 

I like the idea of a video on XML and JSON more than a talk.  A video posted onto Youtube would be useful for many more people and for many more years as newbies arrive at the ontological stomping ground.

 

-Rich

 

Sincerely,

Rich Cooper

EnglishLogicKernel.com

Rich AT EnglishLogicKernel DOT com

9 4 9 \ 5 2 5 - 5 7 1 2

---

From: ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ontolog-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Duane Nickull
Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2014 11:48 AM
To: [ontolog-forum]
Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] [OT]: No confidential or private messages on this open, public, list, please [was: fitness of XML for ontology ... ]

 

Peter:

 

There are many statements being made about XML and JSON.  It might be useful for a session on pure technical aspects of XML parsing to help give those who are not familiar with programming a backgrounder on the topic.

 

I'd like to volunteer to give such a session if there is interest.  It may help to facilitate a shared knowledge on the topic.

 

Please let me know and I will arrange to schedule and deliver a session..

 

Duane

***********************************

Technoracle Advanced Systems Inc.

Consulting and Contracting; Proven Results!

i.  Neo4J, PDF, Java, LiveCycle ES, Flex, AIR, CQ5 & Mobile

b. http://technoracle.blogspot.com

t.  @duanenickull

 

 

 

From: Peter Yim <peter.yim@xxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: "[ontolog-forum]" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Tuesday, 4 February, 2014 7:23 AM
To: "[ontolog-forum]" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [ontolog-forum] [OT]: No confidential or private messages on this open, public, list, please [was: fitness of XML for ontology ... ]

 

Duane & All,

Please observe our Open IPR Policy[1] and refrain from posting confidential, private, privileged messages, or the like, on this open, public, mailing list. Any such claim will be ignored.

Kindly ensure statements or clauses making claims to privacy or confidentiality do not accompany your posts. Use a different email address to subscribe to our mailing lists of that would make things simpler for you.

  [1] http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?WikiHomePage#nid32

Thanks & regards. =ppy

Peter Yim
Co-convener, ONTOLOG
--

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: "Duane Nickull" <duane@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Feb 3, 2014 2:04 PM
Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] fitness of XML for ontology (WAS: [ontology-summit] The tools are not the problem (yet))
To: "[ontolog-forum]" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc:

JSON was driven by a technical requirement for a lightweight object notation for passing data to and from user interfaces.

 

XML is heavy to parse and there was no JS specific compliant parser.  Even if there was, it would be overkill for most lighter-weight implementations.  For lightweight front ends, serializing data into native _javascript_ objects means they are parsed and can be worked with on the ht display list much more efficiently than XML.  Xml is more for back end to back end.  JSON is for more back end to front end.

 

Duane

***********************************

Technoracle Advanced Systems Inc.

Consulting and Contracting; Proven Results!

i.  Neo4J, PDF, Java, LiveCycle ES, Flex, AIR, CQ5 & Mobile

b. http://technoracle.blogspot.com

t.  @duanenickull

 

 

NOTICE: This e-mail and any attachments may contain confidential information. If you are the intended recipient, please consider this a privileged communication, not to be forwarded without explicit approval from the sender.  If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail, delete this e-mail and destroy any copies. Any dissemination or use of this information by a person other than the intended recipient is unauthorized and may be illegal. The originator reserves the right to monitor all e-mail communications through its networks for quality control purposes.

 

 

 

From: John McClure <jmcclure@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: "[ontolog-forum]" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Monday, 3 February, 2014 1:24 PM
To: <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [ontolog-forum] fitness of XML for ontology (WAS: [ontology-summit] The tools are not the problem (yet))

 

FYI, Google adopted ECMA JSON ("_javascript_ Object Notation") for interoperability with the Common Language Infrastructure, not because Google was trying surreptitiously to get LISP into the mainstream based upon a/some belief in its inherent superiority. It is the CLI that prompts W3 to normatively accept JSON as an interchange protocol, not some implicit admission that they made a 'mistake' with XML.
/jmc

On 2/3/2014 12:15 PM, John F Sowa wrote:

On 2/3/2014 12:55 PM, Duane Nickull wrote:

XMl has nothing to do with semantics.

XML has the ability to make data portable and can be used to transfer

ontological or semantic models, or fragments thereof, between applications.

I agree with both of those points.

JSON notation (or the very similar LISP notation) could have been

adopted by the W3C for exactly the same purposes, but without the bloat

or excessive coding.  LISP, for example, has a built-in parser that

requires only two operators: CAR and CDR.  (AKA head and tail.)

The Google researchers understood those issues very well.  That's why

they adopted JSON.  And the W3C has finally blessed JSON as an option.

In 1999, Guha wanted to use LISP notation for RDF.  He was also

working at Netscape then, which had designed JSON.  If the W3C had

let him do what he wanted to do, they would have saved us from the

bloat, excessive coding, and unreadable garbage.

John

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