ppy/OntologySummit2014-s07_chat-transcript_unedited_20140227a.txt ------ Chat transcript from room: summit_20140227 2014-02-27 GMT-08:00 [PST] ------ [9:13] PeterYim: Welcome to the = OntologySummit2014 session-07 Track-E: Hackathon Launch - Thu 2014-02-27 = Summit Theme: OntologySummit2014: "Big Data and Semantic Web Meet Applied Ontology" Session Topic: OntologySummit2014 Hackathon Launch Session Co-chairs: Mr. AnatolyLevenchuk (TechInvestLab) & Mr. DanBrickley (Google) Panelists / Briefings: * Mr. VictorAgroskin (TechInvestLab) - "Reference data for Anime and Manga: Semantic Linking and Publishing of Diverse Data-Sets" * Mr. MikeBennett (EDM Council) (in absentia) & Dr. GaryBergCross (SOCoP) - "Ontology Design Patterns and Semantic Abstractions in Ontology Integration" * Dr. VictorChernov (NitrosData) - "Optimized SPARQL performance management via native API" * Professor Dr. TillMossakowski & Dr. OliverKutz (University of Magdeburg) - "Ontohub consolidation" * Professor KenBaclawski (Northeastern University) - "Semantic Annotation of the Ontolog Community Environment" * Dr. AmandaVizedom (Ind. Consultant) - "An ontological catalogue of ontology and metadata vocabulary characteristics relevant to suitability for semantic web and big data applications" Logistics: * Refer to details on session page at: http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ConferenceCall_2014_02_27 * (if you haven't already done so) please click on "settings" (top center) and morph from "anonymous" to your RealName; also please enable "Show timestamps" while there. * Mute control (phone keypad): *7 to un-mute ... *6 to mute * Attn: Skype users ... see: http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ConferenceCall_2014_02_27#nid469Z ** you may connect to (the skypeID) "joinconference" whether or not it indicates that it is online (i.e. even if it says it is "offline," you should still be able to connect to it.) ** if you are using skype and the connection to "joinconference" is not holding up, try using (your favorite POTS or VoIP line, etc.) either your phone, skype-out or google-voice and call the US dial-in number: +1 (206) 402-0100 ... when prompted enter Conference ID: 141184# ** Can't find Skype Dial pad? *** for Windows Skype users: Can't find Skype Dial pad? ... it's under the "Call" dropdown menu as "Show Dial pad" *** for Linux Skype users: if the dialpad button is not shown in the call window you need to press the "d" hotkey to enable it * when posting in this Chat-room, kindly observe the following ... ** whenever a name is used, please use the full WikiWord name format (every time you don't, some volunteer will have to make an edit afterwards) ** always provide context (like: "[ref. JaneDoe's slide#12], I think the point about context is great" ... rather than "that's great!" as the latter would mean very little in the archives.) ** when responding to a specific individual's earlier remarks, please cite his/her full WikiWord names *and* the timestamp (in PST) of his/her post that you are responding to (e.g. "@JaneDoe [11:09] - I agree, but, ...") ** use fully qualified url's (include http:// ) without symbols (like punctuations or parentheses, etc.) right before of after that URL . == Proceedings == . [8:39] anonymous morphed into EdBernot [9:20] anonymous morphed into AlexShkotin [9:29] anonymous morphed into VictorChernov [9:32] Dennis Wisnosky: HI! [9:32] PeterYim: Hi Dennis [9:37] anonymous1 morphed into VitRudovich [9:38] AnatolyLevenchuk: Ontology Summit Hackathon main page: http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?OntologySummit2014_Hackathon [9:38] PeterYim: == AnatolyLevenchuk starts the session on behalf of the Track-E co-champions - see slides under: http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ConferenceCall_2014_02_27#nid47PW [9:39] AmandaVizedom1 morphed into AmandaVizedom [9:40] DanBri: As ever, I can't see the slides [9:41] AmandaVizedom: Dan, can you not download them from the wiki and view along? [9:41] AmandaVizedom: (that is how many of us do it, rather than the vnc) [9:42] anonymous morphed into RaviSharma [9:47] PeterYim: ... on slide#5 now [9:49] anonymous morphed into Les Morgan [9:49] AmandaVizedom: Related to what AnatolyLevunchuk is saying now about advertising the individual projects and soliciting additional participants: If anyone wants such messages to be broadcast via @OntologySummit on Twitter and/or +Ontology Summit on Google+, it is easily done. Send content to me if you want the message to originate from those accounts, or post from your own account and tag or mention those accounts, and I will Retweet /Share automatically. Relatedly, those of us with our own accounts can help by Retweeting / sharing in turn. [9:50] List of members: AlexShkotin, AmandaVizedom, AnatolyLevenchuk, AndreaWesterinen, AnneThessen, CarolBean, ChristophLange, DanBri, Dennis Wisnosky, EdBernot, Gary Berg-Cross, Gary Berg-Cross1, KenBaclawski, Les Morgan, Mark Fox, MichaelGruninger, MikeDean, OliverKutz, PeterYim, RaviSharma, SimonSpero, TimFinin, ToddSchneider, VictorAgroskin, VictorChernov, VitRudovich [9:51] anonymous morphed into LamarHenderson [9:53] PeterYim: == VictorAgroskin presenting the "Reference data for Anime and Manga: Semantic Linking and Publishing of Diverse Data-Sets" hackathon project ... [9:53] DanBri: http://ontolog.cim3.net/file/work/OntologySummit2014/2014-02-27_OntologySummit2014_Hackathon-Launch/OntologySummit2014_Hackathon-Launch_Anime-Manga-Dataset-Semantics--VictorAgroskin_20140227.pdf [9:53] anonymous morphed into BobbinTeegarden [9:56] SimonSpero: There is a slight problem with committing to a 4-D extensional ontology for this application. [9:58] AmandaVizedom: Question for VictorAgroskin - have you looked at the existing ontological representations of conceptual works, publication, media, and related areas? Is your goal to model these things specifically using the constructs and tools you use to model engineering systems, rather than the constructs and tools that have grown up around these areas natively? [9:58] SimonSpero: sticking to things that are 4-D relevant, the fictional character "Doraemon" began in 1969 (has temporal extent) [9:59] SimonSpero: In the fictional world, the character was created in the future. [10:00] PeterYim: @VictorAgroskin, I am trying to reach out to some people in the anime & manga domain, in the US and in Japan, to see if they can team up some effort and join you [10:02] PeterYim: @VictorAgroskin, ... (excuse me for a very basic question) does "Dublin Core" show up anywhere in this project? [10:02] AmandaVizedom: re: my [12:58], Victor's slides 5 and 6 answered my question. Thanks. [10:02] AndreaWesterinen: @SimonSpero [9:59] Certainly context comes into play here. The context of the creative work, versus the context portrayed in the work. [10:02] DanBri: (this is nice. I put a manga example into https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DBpedia#Examples a couple of years ago, by coincidence) [10:02] PeterYim: ... on slide#7 now [10:02] SimonSpero: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-schemabibex/2013Dec/0001.html [10:04] SimonSpero: http://new.livestream.com/hugeinc/events/2474611 [10:04] SimonSpero: [Peter Olson of Marvel: "Marvel Entertainment's Peter Olson talk about how Marvel uses graph theory and the emerging NoSQL space to understand, model and ultimately represent the uncanny Marvel Universe." [10:06] PeterYim: == GaryBergCross presenting the "Ontology Design Patterns and Semantic Abstractions in Ontology Integration" hackathon project ... [10:06] SimonSpero: @AndreaWesterinen : The issue is the extensionality and the use of 4D vs 3+1; what is the location in space of the fictional character in the real world right now. [10:06] DanBri: slides http://ontolog.cim3.net/file/work/OntologySummit2014/2014-02-27_OntologySummit2014_Hackathon-Launch/OntologySummit2014_Hackathon-Launch_ODP--MikeBennett-GaryBergCross_20140227.pdf [10:10] AnneThessen: Regarding GaryBergCross Slide #4: would also be interesting to include crime and illness rates for different neighborhoods once the accident data are in place. [10:12] AndreaWesterinen: @SimonSpero I agree that this is not just 4-D but 4-D in context (5-D), kind of like quad stores, versus triple stores. [10:14] AnneThessen: GaryBergCross, Slide #11: Could also ask which places/neighborhoods are risky to live in [10:14] AnatolyLevenchuk: @GaryBergCross -- outcomes should include some kind of artifacts. [10:14] PeterYim: == VictorChernov presenting the "Optimized SPARQL performance management via native API" hackathon project ... [10:15] DanBri: http://ontolog.cim3.net/file/work/OntologySummit2014/2014-02-27_OntologySummit2014_Hackathon-Launch/OntologySummit2014_Hackathon-Launch_SPARQL-Peformance-Benchmarking--VictorChernov_20140227.pdf [10:16] Gary Berg-Cross1: @Anne Both of your suggestions sound like exciting possibilities...Thanks. can you suggest references and perhaps people who might be interested in participating? [10:16] RaviSharma: Fantastic as well from Gary BergCross and Mike Bennett Great attempt at building real life risk model using Ontology and SPARQL etc. for traffic and accident and design patterns. [10:17] VictorAgroskin: we're also accustomed to work with possible worlds, so spacio-temporal extent of Mikey in 2017 is not a problem [10:18] Gary Berg-Cross1: @Anatolgy The artifact includes a new ODP and it might include triplified data and SPARQL for asking relevant Qs. [10:20] VictorAgroskin: there is a big problem in 4D extensionalism with "information" entities - strings, texts, bit streams. The modelling prescribed by ISO 15926 for these is very confusing for people who see it for the first time. [10:21] PeterYim: @VictorChernov, what is the approximate size of the datasets (or subsets) do you think you will be benchmarking? [10:22] PeterYim: ^benchmarking with [10:22] VictorAgroskin: As for the context in possible worlds - it can be defined in a simple way. Just declare each possible world one (big) individual and describe all its heroes as 4D parts of it. [10:22] PeterYim: == OliverKutz presenting the "Ontohub consolidation" hackathon project ... [10:23] VictorChernov: 'cause we are going to run benchmark on a simple desktop computer we need to limit the subset by approximately 100 mln triples [10:24] anonymous morphed into LamarHenderson [10:26] AndreaWesterinen: @VictorAgroskin [13:22] Agree, that was my point. :-) [10:27] PeterYim: == KenBaclawski presenting the "Semantic Annotation of the Ontolog Community Environment" hackathon project ... [10:28] VictorAgroskin: @PeterYim I'll prefer to use 4D modelling for as many concepts as possible. For example, I'll prefer to model Creator as a participant in Creation activity together with a Creation each playing (being classified) by a corresponding role. What is good in our pattern methodology - we can describe the same n-ary relation in several way - with ISO 15926 templates, or with RDF predicates defined by DublinCore. [10:31] SimonSpero: @VictorAgroskin: do you treat fictitious characters in the real world as supervening over all physical supports (including bits of the brain thinking about that character)? [10:34] PeterYim: == AmandaVizedom presenting the "An ontological catalogue of ontology and metadata vocabulary characteristics relevant to suitability for semantic web and big data applications" hackathon project ... [10:37] AndreaWesterinen: @AmandaVizedom This ontology development is one of the goals of Track A. [10:38] Gary Berg-Cross1: @Amanda What do you see the relevance, if any, of OMV Ontology Metadata Vocabulary? [10:39] VictorAgroskin: @SimonSpero There are no fictitious characters in the real world (if you mean by the "real" the one we're in and will eventually be). However identical the world appears to our world, the world of Tolstoy is an alternative reality. [10:40] PeterYim: ... on slide#4 now [10:42] NancyWiegand: @Baclawski, Is there a programming language involved in changing from the current wiki to the purple semantic media wiki, or how is the translation done? [10:42] PeterYim: @AmandaVizedom ... the OOR team has spent quite a bit of effort studying what is relevant metadata that needs to be captured for an ontology (effort lead by MichaelGruninger) ... that's not quite for vocabulary, though ... but definitely worth pooling that effort (and folks involved) and lessons learned there - ref. http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?OOR/ConferenceCall_2013_10_08#nid3YDE [10:42] Gary Berg-Cross1: @Andrea and @Amanda I would add to Andrea's comment that "This ontology development is one of the goals of Track A." that the development of your catalog would help reuse, so in a way it is a tool. [10:44] VictorAgroskin: @SimonSpero relation between the brain of the engineer and a skyscraper is not different in this sense from relation between Lucas brain and Yoda. [10:44] RaviSharma: Amanda - thanks for a very comprehensive preparation for Hackathon. [10:44] PeterYim: == open Q&A and Discussion segment (ALL) ... please make suggestions for additional projects; merging projects; elaborations, enhancement, extension to proposed projects, as well as teaming up in preparation for the Mar-29 (Saturday) Hackathon Day [10:45] AndreaWesterinen: @AmandaVizedom Perhaps we could use the ontology to annotate an existing ontology in OOR?? [10:46] DanBri: http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?OpenOntologyRepository [10:46] PeterYim: and http://oor.net [10:48] DanBri: (PeterYim, how do we remove people from the chat tool queue once they've spoken?) [10:48] DanBri: (thanks) [10:49] PeterYim: @Dan and All; the "hand button" toggles the raised hand ... therefore, anyone who raised his/her hand can lower it afterwards [10:49] MichaelGruninger: @Amanda: are you trying to use metadata to describe an ontology together with metadata to describe an application, and then using this to match suitable ontologies to applications? [10:49] SimonSpero: @VictorAgroskin: This is a remarkably useful book, despite the title : very much about reasons to include abstract objects in ones ontology - http://www.amazon.com/Fiction-Metaphysics-Cambridge-Studies-Philosophy/dp/0521065216 [10:50] PeterYim: @Dan, you can click on the "hand on the left of the green-higlighted name" ... that should remove the raised hand too [10:50] KenBaclawski: @[13:42] NancyWiegand: MediaWiki uses PHP, and this is the language that is normally used for wiki development and migration. However, there is a ReSTful web service interface that allows one to interact with the wiki using any language. I have successfully used Java for the last Ontology Summit. [10:50] DanBri: I successfully clicked RaviSharma away; RaviSharma you're next! [10:50] BartGajderowicz: @AmandaVizedom would it make sense to look at the structured data each application uses, as it's already tagged with columns, etc? This could be tied to ontological concepts in relevant ontologies on the web. [10:51] DanBri: any more speakers for the audio queue? please click the 'raise hand' icon. [10:51] AndreaWesterinen: @AmandaVizedom We could possibly use "example" annotations in the developed ontology. And, as you say, capture "relevance" in annotations. [10:53] PeterYim: @OliverKutz, does Ontohub already mandate the capture of Ontology metadata (e.g. conforming to OMV) prior to an ontology submission? [10:56] TillMossakowski: @Peter: yes, it does, at least the web interface does (via git, this is hard to ensure...). [10:56] VictorAgroskin: @@SimonSpero Thanks, I'll look at it. [10:58] AndreaWesterinen: @MichaelGruninger, AmandaVizedom I would think that we could bring in Ontology Metadata Vocabulary (at least portions of it) and other ontologies/concepts (SKOS, Dublin Core, ...), and then use an "integrating" ontology/.owl file. [10:58] PeterYim: @Till ... thank you [10:59] DanBri: (I'm about to be kicked from my meeting room...) [10:59] VitRudovich: @VictorAgroskin: How do you went to work with otaku? [10:59] DanBri: Very much agree with what Anatoly is saying; ontologies are most useful when attention goes also to the data, hybrid reasoning, stats etc. [11:00] PeterYim: @DanBri ... noted, we'll (read: Anatoly) keep things moving (if we don't hear from you) [11:01] AmandaVizedom: @AndreaWesternin: Yes, I agree that we may well want to separate our focused catalogue & its alignment to existing ontologies & concepts. [11:01] PeterYim: [ref. AnatolyLevenchuk's comment that we should look beyond the "Ontology" box] well said, Anatoly! [11:01] AndreaWesterinen: Building on my previous comment [13:58], we would then not only define data for reuse but also use ODPs and approaches for reuse. [11:01] DanBri: I think each of the projects has plenty of potential, I'm not worried on that aspect. [11:03] VictorAgroskin: @VitRudovich I'm working along this one for years. He is chairing our meeting here by a strange coincidence. [11:04] VictorAgroskin: But when I came to work with him - he wasn't an otaku. [11:04] DanBri: Peter, can you wrap us up? [11:04] AnatolyLevenchuk: @VitRodovich, you are an example of our otaku relations management :-) [11:05] MichaelGruninger: I think that the hackathon project proposals look great! I don't see a need to have the participants change the scope of their projects [11:05] Gary Berg-Cross1: Anatoly - You mentioned engineering risk as one possible topic for the ODP integration project dealing with risk and accidents. Please send me refs to work if you can. [11:06] VitRudovich: @VictorAgroskin The question is about the slide 8. Are additional anime experts (without ontology knowledge) needed? [11:06] DanBri: (lost audio now but still reading) [11:07] DanBri: re Anime, for dataset, Freebase has quite a lot: http://www.freebase.com/base/animemanga [11:07] MichaelGruninger: There also seems to be good alignment between the projects and the work that is being done in the other Tracks [11:07] Gary Berg-Cross1: Note - Session 2 of Track A is next Thursday... [11:07] DanBri: see https://developers.google.com/freebase/data for RDF dumps [11:07] PeterYim: I agree with MichaelGruninger's (verbal) comment that the projects as proposed are good as they are ... the challenge would still be in gathering the mix of people to join each of the hackathon project [11:08] AndreaWesterinen: @GaryBergCross I know that there is a http://www.WikiCrime.org link for crimes in Brazil (there was a presentation on this at STIDS 2012). There are other tools that exist for getting crime data, but I have not used them ( http://www.crimereports.com ). [11:09] VictorAgroskin: @VitRudovich I had not met a single real expert yet except Anatoly who is teaching me bits and pieces about the meaning of a teardrop on the cheek or something [11:09] BartGajderowicz1 morphed into BartGajderowicz [11:09] DanBri: for crime, http://www.ucrdatatool.gov/ http://www.google.com/publicdata/explore?ds=b1tlmra7lb7a9_ [11:10] SimonSpero: @DanBri: also http://myanimelist.net/modules.php?go=api [11:11] AndreaWesterinen: @DanBri [14:09] Thanks. I know that there is lots of data. I listed a few that I had heard about (by no means an endorsement of their quality). [11:11] AmandaVizedom: A comment just came in via twitter about project 3 (benchmarking). @OntologySummit responded by encouraging participation: "All projects open for improvement! Please consider joining in. Teams will evolve projects collaboratively, learn from each other." [11:12] DanBri: :) [11:13] Gary Berg-Cross1: I agree that the core team should have spent time getting familiar with each others as well as the topic and tools. [11:13] DanBri: ok folks I have to run again. One more week of meetings/flights/hotels and I'll be back at my desk and hopefully able to engage a bit more with project specifics... [11:14] Gary Berg-Cross1: Should we advertize on https://www.hackerleague.org/hackathons ??? [11:15] Gary Berg-Cross1: Hackathon hero also advertises events...http://www.hackathonhero.com/ [11:17] OliverKutz: fine for us. [11:17] Gary Berg-Cross1: Yep the responsibility is clear...and actually underway.. [11:17] PeterYim: AnatolyLevenchuk: project leads will be taking their projects forward from here on ... let's continue to communicate (and possibly coordinate) via the [ontology-summit] list ... but each project lead shall be championing their own hackathon project (advertise, recruit, setup infrastructure, setup schedule etc.) [11:18] EdBernot: Thanks all. Great stuff! [11:18] AmandaVizedom: @GaryBerg-Cross Good idea. There is also at least one hackathon twitter-feed miner; if you tweet anything with #hackathon it will grab it. I can't remember which site the collected things end up, though. [11:18] Gary Berg-Cross1: I expect him to set up a page. [11:19] PeterYim: great session! [11:19] Gary Berg-Cross1: We will populate our page once he creates it.. [11:19] PeterYim: AnatolyLevenchuk: I will set up a link to each project page from the main Hackathon page [11:19] BartGajderowicz: Many semantic web groups on http://meetup.com [11:19] Gary Berg-Cross1: Bye... [11:22] PeterYim: Please mark you calendars and reserve this time, every Thursday, for the OntologySummit2014 virtual panel session series. In particular ... Session-08 will be up next Thursday - Thu 2014.03.06 (same time) - OntologySummit2014: "Track A: Use and Reuse of Semantic Content - II" - see developing details at: http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ConferenceCall_2014_03_06 [11:22] PeterYim: -- session ended: 11:20 am PST -- [11:23] List of attendees: AlexShkotin, AmandaVizedom, AmandaVizedom1, AnatolyLevenchuk, AndreaWesterinen, AnneThessen, BartGajderowicz, BartGajderowicz1, BobbinTeegarden, CarolBean, ChristophLange, DanBri, Dennis Wisnosky, EarlGlynn, EdBernot, Frank Olken, Gary Berg-Cross, Gary Berg-Cross1, KenBaclawski, LamarHenderson, LeoObrst, Les Morgan, Mark Fox, MichaelGruninger, MikeDean, NancyWiegand, OliverKutz, PeterYim, RaviSharma, SimonSpero, TillMossakowski, TimFinin, ToddSchneider, VictorAgroskin, VictorChernov, VitRudovich, anonymous, anonymous1, vnc2 ------